WEBVTT

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Good morning and happy holidays. This meeting of the

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Public Utility Commission of Texas will come to order

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to consider matters that have been duly posted with

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the Secretary of State for December 14th, 2023 for

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the record. My name is Kathleen Jackson. I'm joined

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by Will McAdams, Lori Cobos and Jimmy Glotfelty.

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Today is a bittersweet day as this is Commissioner

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McAdams last open meeting with us as a commissioner

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of the PUC C will, on behalf of all Texans, I want

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to thank you for your tireless efforts. Since being

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appointed as the first new commissioner after Winter

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Storm Uri, you stepped up to the challenge with a desire

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to make a difference and to make the grid more reliable

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resilient and affordable. You've worked with your fellow

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commissioners, members of the legislature, staff RCO

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stakeholders and members of the public to achieve the

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goal we all share to keep the lights on. You've been

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an invaluable resource to me, the puc and to the state

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of Texas. We greatly appreciate your leadership and

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wish you the best of luck will thank you so much for

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your service to Texas. I know some of the other things

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I will follow that with.

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I will follow that with um my uh gratitude for being

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your wingman over here. Um I know you're not uh air

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force so that might be offensive to you. But uh I still

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would uh as you say, uh get in a foxhole with you

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any time um to fight these battles to um do what's

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right for the people, the companies, the uh for Texas

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for the long term. And we've had a great opportunity

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to work together on the ad er task force.

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That was your leadership and my nudging you all in

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one direction, but you all, you led that your, your

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team led that and, and Texas is going to be much better

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for it. And I will say that I was so happy having

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been in this business for 30 years to, to watch the

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first few months, you grow from your understanding

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of the market. Obviously, you knew a lot from the legislature

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legislative side. But gosh, it was just great to see

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you stand up and be your own person and lead and lead

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and lead. And I know that's to your core, that's the

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way you are. And I'm just uh proud to have been here

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with you and uh I know our friendship will last forever

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So, thanks for you. Thank you.

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Well, um we're gonna miss you um as having been, you

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know, part of the first set of leadership that showed

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up here after winter storm Uri, you know, we all came

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in here and um had a very challenging um mission right

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from day one, implementing all the legislation that

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got passed in 21 after winter storm Uri, engaging on

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several rounds of market reform discussions. Um You

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know, it's just been the amount of work that we've

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accomplished over the last, you know, two years has

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been, I mean, insurmountable, right? And, and for that

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I thank you for all of your leadership, your service

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your support, your friendship, you've been an outstanding

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um, commissioner and, and like Commissioner Gelt, he

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said, you know, I did some work with you out of the

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legislature here and there, but watching you grow and

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and learn the industry and all of your work with ERCOT

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SPP, all of your, um, you know, high lo, you know,

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your major accomplishments in ad er, and, um, other

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areas that I know you are very passionate about, um

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your passion, your commitment for the better, betterment

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of Texas is gonna be missed. Um, I know we're gonna

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miss you and, um, you've been a dear colleague, a dear

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friend and, you know, it's been great being in the

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foxhole with you. You're a good, you're a good, good

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foxhole roommate and, um, but I know you'll be around

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and, uh,

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but, um, you know, um, thank you so much. Thank you

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for your leadership and, and everything you've done

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We're gonna miss you.

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Thank you madam chair. Yeah, I just briefly would add

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um, you know, going first was really important, you

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know, on March 15th of 21 Connie and I fo found ourselves

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with, uh, with no one at the DAIS and, uh, being first

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is always difficult. Um, and, and I, I've told you

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privately how much I appreciate that you were willing

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to go first and, and what that meant and how that helped

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the, the 21 session, you know, really turn around for

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us. And, um, we've had, we, you and I have had a

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lot of, a lot of really good policy discussions, some

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some, a little more contentious than other ones. Um

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but I've appreciated it all and, uh just wanted to

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say, you know, in front of everybody, thank you and

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thank you for going first, appreciate your Thomas.

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So I would say, um, my first thought when we were told

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Will McAdams was headed this way was thank goodness

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someone who speaks electricity.

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And, um, you know, of course, we're well acquainted

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with you and, and your um expertise and dedication

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to, to good public policy from working with you, um

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from down the street over the years. Um Thomas and

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I were sitting in a very lonely hallway, um, on that

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day he referenced and you strolled in, you basically

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said we've got this and never looked back. Uh You know

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your, your leadership on our work and policy has been

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outstanding as everyone has mentioned, but also your

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support for the staff at this agency and helping me

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and Thomas plan to build, build back um to uh the growing

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agency we are today has been phenomenal and you always

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have M and MS, so you'll be missed. Thank you. And

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we will really miss your uh your facial expressions

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telling us exactly what you're thinking. Thank you

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Uh Thank you madam chair. Um I've gone through a lot

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of emotional waves today uh already, um I, I considered

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having ex and I apologize to the public in the audience

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for having to endure this. Uh This is kind of my graduation

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day. Um And uh but you're a valedictorian for once

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I appreciate that.

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I, I considered doing impromptu extemporaneous speaking

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but I wrote it down because I might get emotional.

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Um As the media outlets have reported, I will be departing

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the commission by the end of this year. As I told the

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reporters, then there comes a point for everybody when

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they evaluate their work life balance and identify

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a need to take a step back, they need to heed that

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that feeling, especially when they need to reset and

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and that point has come for me in, as I said, then

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this is a time for new blood to come in and to

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continue the work and momentum that we have created

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and started here. Um Members of the commission members

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of the staff and to the public at large. I want you

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to know that the opportunity to serve on the Public

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Utility Commission of Texas has been one of the most

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one of the highest and true honors of my life. And

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I am extremely grateful to the governor for allowing

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me the opportunity to serve. As we have long said,

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this is not an easy assignment. The current commission

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was composed under extreme circumstances. It seems

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to me that 2021 was uh was a defined demarcation line

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and uh time and especially for those working at this

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agency, there is now a pre 2021 history for the PUC

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and a post 2021 history that has yet to be made and

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and it's never going back. And the one thing that is

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certain things have changed and I feel privileged to

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have been here at that transition during that transition

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Um The function that this agency serves is essential

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and nothing's going to change that. I think I said

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it in a memo, but our role as regulators is to instill

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and maintain confidence in the rule of law, spirit

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of fair play and competitive neutrality in an environment

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with large and powerful corporate forces all to ensure

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the best possible outcomes for Texas consumers and

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the people of Texas. And this would not be possible

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without the people serving in this agency, the rank

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and file staff who are the unsung heroes that are working

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day in and day out to do the right as they see

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the right and you have done that incredibly well

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in so far as my experience. And as I depart, I would

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like to publicly thank my team, which was of such a

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high caliber that we were able to help steady the ship

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at a time when it needed it. Creighton mcmurray, my

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legal counsel was the intellectual muscle that allowed

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us to spread the field and make an impact in proceedings

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ranging from CCN cases of high import to market design

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which was contentious as referenced. Nothing I did

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in my time at this commission would have been possible

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without Creighton. And uh and I want people to know

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it. Donna Johnson was the beating heart of our office

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providing the organizational support that made our

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policy work possible and providing me the confidence

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that I could get involved in projects in far flung

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places like Southwest power Pool and make a difference

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knowing that the trains would keep running on time

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and the office would function and not lose a step.

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Tiffany Wu was the policy and analytical light of our

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office, providing the energy and intellectual curiosity

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necessary to take on the toughest policy and policy

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challenges and produce outstanding results. ADR pilot

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the integration of virtual power plants in the ERCOT

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system is no better case in point. And then finally

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I would like to thank my wife for letting me volunteer

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for this duty even though she said, well, you're gonna

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do this anyway. So what

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so, uh and, and, and also, finally, I would like to

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thank thank Lori, Jimmy and Kathleen. Um, Lori, you're

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the rock, you're the engine of the dias,

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you have the institutional knowledge upon which the

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custom, customs and norms of the commission will continue

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But Jimmy is the energy of the DAO and, and he has

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the experience and the expertise to push the evolution

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of the agency and, and the market for the betterment

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And Kathleen, your leadership, as I have said is uh

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is unsung but it's essential and it's, it's wonderful

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You are the glue that will hold the agency together

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during a time of, of transition and that's what we

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have. Um I sincerely uh one of the greatest gifts for

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me was the friendship that we gained here and uh

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I will miss it. Thank you. Thank you.

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So, moving on with the agenda, public comments for

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general matters will be taken up when we get to section

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two item. Number 16, public comments related to a specific

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agenda item will be heard when that item is taken up

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Speakers will be limited to three minutes. Each commoners

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should not approach the table unless oral argument

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has been granted or they've been invited by a commissioner

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Sheila. Will you please walk us through the consent

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items on today's agenda? Yes, ma'am. Good morning commissioners

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by individual ballot. The following items are placed

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on your consent agenda items. Two through four and

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nine through 15. I will entertain a motion to approve

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the items just described by Sheila. So

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I have a motion and a second all in favor. Say I

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I motion passes. First up is item number one, Sheila

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Will you please lay out this item? Yes, ma'am. Item

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number one is stuck at number 50788. The ratepayers

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appeal of the decision by Windermere Oaks Water Supply

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Corporation to change water and sewer rates before

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you is the proposal for a decision from SOAH. The commission

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heard oral argument from the parties in this proceeding

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at the November 2nd. At the meeting, the ratepayer

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representatives, Windemere and commission staff each

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filed exceptions and replies to exceptions to the proposal

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for decision. The A LJS Father memo stating that they

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do not recommend changes to the proposal for decision

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Um Commissioner, we have a commissioner memo on this

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item. Uh Thank you, Sheila. And um, I'm gonna try to

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just hit the high points of the memo. There's a lot

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of information in there. This is a, a complicated case

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with a lot of different issues um involved. However

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I think that the, the main issues and um points I'm

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trying to make in the memo are um when you read in

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harmony, subsections J in the, of the Texas water code

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section 1304 3. Um The commission is required to preserve

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Windermere's financial integrity at the time. The appealed

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rates were set. Therefore, the scope of the evidence

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that the commission may consider in this proceeding

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should be limited to the information that was available

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to Windemere Board on February 11th 2020. And evidence

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and the evidence of the reasonable expenses incurred

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by Windemere in this appeal proceeding. Um Windemere

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failed to carry its burden of proof. Demonstrating

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that the um appealed rates were are in the public interest

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The net annual revenue requirement that Windermere's

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board should have used to fix Windermere's rates on

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February 11th, 2020 is $359,378. Um The $356,378 in

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net operating reserves plus 3000 in legal expenses

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are what comprised that? Um What should have been the

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net annual revenue requirement that the board should

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have used to fix the rates in order to preserve Windermere's

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financial integrity. At the time, the appealed rates

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were set. Windemere should have, should be authorized

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to recover its outstanding 2019 legal debt through

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a monthly surcharge collected over 12 months. Windermere's

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volumetric and fixed rate should be calculated using

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the net annual revenue requirement approved by the

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commission with 60% of that allocated to water service

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and 40% allocated to sewer service commission. Staff

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should identify which costs in the net revenue requirement

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are fixed and variable and those costs should be assigned

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to fixed and variable rates accordingly. Because of

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that annual revenue requirement that I recommend the

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commission approve is lower than the revenues that

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Windemere collected under the appeal rates. I recommend

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that the commission order Windemere to refund the difference

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to ratepayers. Finally, I recommend that a compliance

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stock could be open to oversee the calculation and

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refund of the over recovery to Windemere ratepayers

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and the implementation of the rate case expense surcharge

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for reasonable expenses that Windemere occurred in

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this appeal proceeding. So ultimately, my, my recommendation

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in action would be to move to adopt the PFD in part

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and reject the PFD in part, authorize commission counsel

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to issue an order, directing commission staff to conduct

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a number run consistent with my memo and our discussion

00:16:22.200 --> 00:16:25.090
and direct OPM to draft an order consistent with the

00:16:25.099 --> 00:16:29.029
commission's decision and that incorporates the results

00:16:29.038 --> 00:16:32.340
in number one for consideration at a future open meeting

00:16:33.830 --> 00:16:36.759
Very good. Do we have any thoughts on this? I'm going

00:16:36.769 --> 00:16:39.259
to try to stay quiet, but I agree with you. I agree

00:16:39.269 --> 00:16:42.379
I'm in agreement with the memo and, and supportive

00:16:42.389 --> 00:16:45.330
of the actions that you recommend. I I'm supportive

00:16:45.340 --> 00:16:47.820
as well. Ok. May I jump in with just one clarification

00:16:47.830 --> 00:16:51.668
to confirmation Commissioner Cobos that the, that your

00:16:51.678 --> 00:16:54.879
motion to approve the proposal decision in part and

00:16:54.889 --> 00:16:57.859
deny the proposal decision in part is for the reasons

00:16:57.869 --> 00:17:00.239
stated in your memo? Yes. Ok, great.

00:17:02.340 --> 00:17:05.209
All right with that. Do you need another motion or

00:17:05.219 --> 00:17:09.449
do I need a second. Let's see. Let's, I think I, I

00:17:09.459 --> 00:17:11.868
believe I heard a motion before but just for belts

00:17:11.880 --> 00:17:13.439
and suspenders, let's go through it one more time to

00:17:13.449 --> 00:17:16.949
be. Confirm that. Ok, I would move to adopt the PFD

00:17:16.959 --> 00:17:20.449
in part and reject the PFD in part, consistent with

00:17:20.500 --> 00:17:25.219
the discussion in my memo. And uh and also include

00:17:25.229 --> 00:17:27.920
the authorization of Commission and Council to issue

00:17:27.930 --> 00:17:30.140
an order, directing commission staff to conduct a number

00:17:30.150 --> 00:17:32.989
one consistent with my memo in our discussion and direct

00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:35.239
opdm to draft an order consistent with the commission's

00:17:35.250 --> 00:17:37.660
decision. And that incorporates the results of the

00:17:37.670 --> 00:17:40.969
number one for consideration in the future open meeting

00:17:42.459 --> 00:17:45.130
I have a motion in second all in favor. Say I I

00:17:45.209 --> 00:17:46.269
motion passes

00:17:48.858 --> 00:17:52.910
items 23 and four have been consented. Next up is item

00:17:52.920 --> 00:17:55.799
number five, Sheila, will you please lay out this item

00:17:56.338 --> 00:18:00.400
Item number five is stuck at number 53682. This is

00:18:00.410 --> 00:18:03.140
the application of the utilities investment company

00:18:03.259 --> 00:18:06.279
to amend its certificate of convenience and necessity

00:18:06.289 --> 00:18:09.229
in Liberty County before you is a joint motion for

00:18:09.239 --> 00:18:12.189
rehearing filed by commission staff and utilities investment

00:18:12.199 --> 00:18:15.150
company and the commission voted to place the motion

00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:17.289
for rehearing on the agenda for this of a meeting.

00:18:18.809 --> 00:18:22.078
I think we should grant rehearing. In part. The party

00:18:22.088 --> 00:18:24.910
showed that the CCN attached to the notice of approval

00:18:24.930 --> 00:18:27.818
misidentified the type of service provided. Therefore

00:18:27.828 --> 00:18:30.130
I would grant rehearing in part solely to correct the

00:18:30.140 --> 00:18:32.959
certificate to state that the utility provides water

00:18:32.969 --> 00:18:36.289
service regarding the counties served. The notice of

00:18:36.299 --> 00:18:38.900
approval is based on evidence in the record and the

00:18:38.910 --> 00:18:41.318
parties do not identify in the evidentiary record of

00:18:41.328 --> 00:18:44.140
factual basis for correcting the counties listed in

00:18:44.150 --> 00:18:47.479
the finding of fact tariff and certificate. Therefore

00:18:47.489 --> 00:18:50.439
we should not make the request change to the list of

00:18:50.449 --> 00:18:53.459
counties through a motion for rehearing. The utility

00:18:53.469 --> 00:18:57.430
should instead seek a minor tariff change in a separate

00:18:57.439 --> 00:19:02.539
proceeding. Any thoughts I'm in agreement in your position

00:19:04.868 --> 00:19:08.189
As do I, I would entertain a motion to grant rehearing

00:19:08.199 --> 00:19:11.630
in part solely to approve a corrected certificate stating

00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:14.199
that utilities investment provides water service.

00:19:15.910 --> 00:19:19.390
I have a motion and second all in favor. Say a motion

00:19:21.390 --> 00:19:23.650
next up is item number six, Sheila, will you please

00:19:23.660 --> 00:19:27.459
lay out this item? Item six is the application of Vista

00:19:27.469 --> 00:19:30.519
Del Rio Property Owners Association for authority to

00:19:30.529 --> 00:19:34.358
change rates before you. As a revised proposed order

00:19:35.559 --> 00:19:37.769
A proposed order was previously filed on September

00:19:37.779 --> 00:19:40.709
21st. Commission staff filed corrections to the proposed

00:19:40.719 --> 00:19:43.779
order. The A LJ filed a revised proposed order with

00:19:43.789 --> 00:19:47.068
commission Staff's Corrections Commission Council memo

00:19:47.078 --> 00:19:49.880
was filed recommending changes and I believe chairman

00:19:49.890 --> 00:19:53.449
Jackson filed a memo. Yes, I did file a memo recommending

00:19:53.459 --> 00:19:56.959
approval of the revised proposed order with modifications

00:19:56.969 --> 00:19:59.969
for accuracy and in accordance with the revised proposed

00:19:59.979 --> 00:20:06.259
tariff filed on November 28th 2023. Any thoughts I'm

00:20:06.299 --> 00:20:06.930
in agreement

00:20:08.969 --> 00:20:11.868
I would move to modify the revised proposed order consistent

00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:15.630
with my memo. Do I have a second, a motion in a

00:20:15.640 --> 00:20:21.130
second, all in favor. Say I I motion passes. Next.

00:20:21.140 --> 00:20:23.868
We will take up items number seven and eight together

00:20:24.009 --> 00:20:27.670
Sheila. Will you please lay out these items? Yes. Uh

00:20:27.680 --> 00:20:31.250
I'm gonna go, I'll do one and followed by the other

00:20:31.259 --> 00:20:35.078
Item seven is stuck at number 54617. This is the application

00:20:35.088 --> 00:20:38.939
of Texas water utilities and southern horizons development

00:20:39.118 --> 00:20:42.618
for the cell transfer or merger of facilities and certificate

00:20:42.630 --> 00:20:45.338
rights in liberty in Montgomery counties. The commission

00:20:45.348 --> 00:20:48.568
requested briefing on threshold issues in this proceeding

00:20:48.699 --> 00:20:51.779
and commission staff, Anna Miller, the Office of Public

00:20:51.789 --> 00:20:54.959
Utility Council and Texas Water Utilities filed briefs

00:20:54.969 --> 00:20:57.973
and reply briefs for item number eight. That's docket

00:20:57.983 --> 00:21:02.015
number 55157. This is the application of Texas water

00:21:02.025 --> 00:21:05.713
utilities and midway water utilities for the sale transfer

00:21:05.723 --> 00:21:09.223
or merger facilities and certificate rights in Grayson

00:21:09.233 --> 00:21:13.184
Harris Hill, Johnson, Montgomery and Palo Pinto counties

00:21:13.634 --> 00:21:16.334
The commissioner also requested briefing on threshold

00:21:16.344 --> 00:21:19.934
issues in this proceeding. Commission, Staff Office

00:21:19.943 --> 00:21:23.555
of Public Utility Council, Double Diamond and the applicants

00:21:23.564 --> 00:21:27.789
filed briefs and reply briefs. I think we should table

00:21:27.799 --> 00:21:30.549
items seven and eight to a future open meeting. So

00:21:30.559 --> 00:21:33.920
we can consider these dockets at the same time or after

00:21:33.969 --> 00:21:38.338
the rule making. And project number 53, 924. Any thoughts

00:21:39.449 --> 00:21:43.650
agree. I agree as well. That sounds like we'll take

00:21:43.660 --> 00:21:47.630
this up then at a future open meeting. Items number

00:21:47.640 --> 00:21:51.029
nine through 15 have been consented. We will now transition

00:21:51.039 --> 00:21:55.390
to section two of our agenda rules projects and miscellaneous

00:21:55.400 --> 00:21:55.920
items.

00:21:59.868 --> 00:22:05.709
Next up is item number 16, general comments for topics

00:22:05.719 --> 00:22:09.059
not specifically posted on this agenda. Speakers will

00:22:09.068 --> 00:22:11.979
be limited to three minutes each. Sheila. Do we have

00:22:11.989 --> 00:22:15.368
anyone from the public signed up to speak? Yes, ma'am

00:22:15.380 --> 00:22:17.318
commissioners. We have one person that signed up to

00:22:17.328 --> 00:22:20.739
speak on item 16, the first, well, one person to sign

00:22:20.750 --> 00:22:23.930
up, Prus read Mr Reid. Do you wanna come on up?

00:22:31.868 --> 00:22:35.368
Thank you all. Thank you. I'll be very brief. Um First

00:22:35.380 --> 00:22:38.500
of all, stay tuned. Cyrus Reed, Lone Star chapter,

00:22:38.509 --> 00:22:41.989
the Sierra Club. Thank you for your service. I've known

00:22:42.000 --> 00:22:44.709
you a long time. I don't have a Christmas gift for

00:22:44.719 --> 00:22:48.209
you, but you, but you do have my respect. Uh We knew

00:22:48.219 --> 00:22:50.338
each other in the legislature. You were always very

00:22:50.348 --> 00:22:54.358
approachable, open to new ideas. Uh Appreciate you

00:22:54.630 --> 00:22:57.219
Um As you leave this position, if you want to grow

00:22:57.229 --> 00:22:59.578
out your hair, let your beard down. I'm all for it

00:22:59.598 --> 00:23:03.719
I am gonna be ok. Great. Thank you. Um I'm here very

00:23:03.729 --> 00:23:07.289
briefly just to say that we submitted comments in the

00:23:07.299 --> 00:23:13.578
winter preparedness docket 55633. You do not have to

00:23:13.588 --> 00:23:19.170
read all 700 pages. Um but they are simply people reacting

00:23:19.180 --> 00:23:21.910
to an action alert. We had put out because we were

00:23:21.920 --> 00:23:25.265
concerned with the RCT proposal to bring back what

00:23:25.275 --> 00:23:28.703
we called zombie power plants. Um But in the, in the

00:23:28.713 --> 00:23:32.875
comments um that were included in those 700 pages of

00:23:32.884 --> 00:23:36.634
about 350 members of the Sierra Club. It's asking you

00:23:36.644 --> 00:23:39.703
in 2024 to look at some of the same issues you and

00:23:39.713 --> 00:23:43.154
I have been discussing which is um make sure that private

00:23:43.164 --> 00:23:47.699
utilities like Oncor A P and others. CenterPoint can

00:23:47.709 --> 00:23:52.219
all do also have winter demand response programs which

00:23:52.229 --> 00:23:54.779
will be important for the winter. And I know that CenterPoint

00:23:54.789 --> 00:23:56.809
has, has asked to have that authorized so they can

00:23:56.818 --> 00:24:01.459
have a 24 7 product. Make sure that because the legislature

00:24:01.469 --> 00:24:06.500
did pass SB 1699 which includes both some clarifications

00:24:06.509 --> 00:24:11.019
on ad but also includes some direction on residential

00:24:11.029 --> 00:24:15.009
demand response that you take that up in 2024. Make

00:24:15.019 --> 00:24:17.949
sure we continue to expand AD R and the virtual power

00:24:17.959 --> 00:24:20.630
plant. And I saw your guys' memo, I'm, I'm all in favor

00:24:20.640 --> 00:24:23.539
of getting the nay involved, hopefully they will. Um

00:24:23.549 --> 00:24:28.118
And then finally, well, two more uh um look again,

00:24:28.130 --> 00:24:30.549
you know, we had those workshops at the beginning of

00:24:30.559 --> 00:24:33.229
this year, look at changes we can make to the energy

00:24:33.239 --> 00:24:37.479
efficiency programs to expand them. Um And then finally

00:24:37.750 --> 00:24:44.118
to the extent that uh um Texas does receive substantial

00:24:44.130 --> 00:24:48.160
amounts of money through Iijar, I for energy efficiency

00:24:48.309 --> 00:24:50.489
that we coordinate that very closely with the other

00:24:50.500 --> 00:24:52.989
agencies and with the private utilities. So tho those

00:24:53.000 --> 00:24:55.680
are the asks, I think they're all things we can accomplish

00:24:55.689 --> 00:24:59.900
in 2024. Uh And that, those are my, my uh New Year's

00:24:59.910 --> 00:25:03.160
resolution and Christmas wishes is um, so myself and

00:25:03.170 --> 00:25:05.009
many members of the Sierra Clover putting it before

00:25:05.019 --> 00:25:07.449
you and with that, I'll, I'll end my comments. Thank

00:25:07.459 --> 00:25:09.140
you. Thank you. Thank you.

00:25:15.578 --> 00:25:19.650
This completes item number 16. Next, we'll be taking

00:25:19.660 --> 00:25:23.368
up item number 30 out of order. Item number 30 is project

00:25:23.380 --> 00:25:27.348
number 55837. The commission's project for the review

00:25:27.358 --> 00:25:30.680
of the value of lost load in the ERCOT market, Sheila

00:25:30.689 --> 00:25:32.828
Do we have anyone from the public signed up to speak

00:25:32.838 --> 00:25:34.910
on item number 30? No, ma'am

00:25:36.750 --> 00:25:39.858
filed its work plan for the BAL study and commission

00:25:39.868 --> 00:25:44.068
staff filed a memo in response. Um Matt Arth with ERCOT

00:25:44.500 --> 00:25:47.959
and Dr Suman Ji with Bradle are here to present the

00:25:47.969 --> 00:25:52.140
plan. Could you please come up and state your names

00:25:52.150 --> 00:25:53.049
for the record?

00:25:55.269 --> 00:25:58.489
Um Good morning Commissioner Matt Arth for ERCOT. And

00:25:58.500 --> 00:26:01.489
I have uh doctor Sanam Sarge, a principal with the

00:26:01.500 --> 00:26:04.390
uh Brattle group who is the uh team lead for Brattle

00:26:04.400 --> 00:26:06.368
on the value of loss load study.

00:26:09.289 --> 00:26:10.358
And Rebecca Z LO with ECO,

00:26:12.848 --> 00:26:17.299
we appreciate the commission's time. Um uh As, as y'all

00:26:17.309 --> 00:26:21.900
saw, we filed a uh v uh survey work plan um, last

00:26:21.910 --> 00:26:26.019
week, um which uh presents um the proposed plan to

00:26:26.029 --> 00:26:29.769
accomplish um the customer survey element of the value

00:26:29.779 --> 00:26:34.000
of lost load um study uh which would be conducted by

00:26:34.009 --> 00:26:37.500
the Brattle Group with uh the, the survey administration

00:26:37.509 --> 00:26:41.618
expertise of, of plan beyond. Um We highlighted a couple

00:26:41.630 --> 00:26:45.709
of things in that filing, one of which would be um

00:26:45.828 --> 00:26:49.219
ERCOT S continued recommendation to use. Um What we're

00:26:49.229 --> 00:26:54.118
referring to is option three, which would be um to

00:26:54.130 --> 00:26:57.979
utilize the uh customer billing contact information

00:26:57.989 --> 00:27:01.430
that ERCOT has in its possession CBC I um which is

00:27:01.439 --> 00:27:04.670
provided by competitive retailers on a monthly basis

00:27:04.818 --> 00:27:07.750
to distribute the survey in the competitive areas of

00:27:08.140 --> 00:27:12.140
CT um And to uh partner with any interested non op

00:27:12.299 --> 00:27:16.828
entities um to uh either uh receive customer contact

00:27:16.838 --> 00:27:21.989
information from them or uh uh uh uh guide them in

00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:24.900
distributing the survey to a select sample of their

00:27:24.910 --> 00:27:29.854
customer. Um uh We've had uh several positive discussions

00:27:29.864 --> 00:27:32.743
with the, with the noy and uh I, I know that there

00:27:32.755 --> 00:27:36.314
is, is support there. I think um it, it's, it's the

00:27:36.324 --> 00:27:37.785
end of the year and it's a busy time. And so I

00:27:37.795 --> 00:27:40.055
think those, those conversations are, are ongoing,

00:27:40.064 --> 00:27:42.894
but we would uh encourage any, any nay that are interested

00:27:42.904 --> 00:27:45.354
in partnering with us to, to reach out to, to myself

00:27:45.364 --> 00:27:48.775
and to uh Ryan King, the, the uh the, the team lead

00:27:48.785 --> 00:27:52.979
at Cott. Um And so, uh perhaps with that, I will uh

00:27:52.989 --> 00:27:56.140
pass it over to Dr Sergei to kind of um give an

00:27:56.150 --> 00:27:59.239
overview of the uh V uh survey work plan and, and we'll

00:27:59.250 --> 00:28:00.900
be happy to answer any questions.

00:28:02.910 --> 00:28:06.618
Good morning commissioners. Um Yeah, so I'm here to

00:28:06.630 --> 00:28:10.338
present an overview of the survey plan. Um It's a 15

00:28:10.358 --> 00:28:12.779
page document, so I'm not really planning to go through

00:28:13.118 --> 00:28:15.979
Uh they, they need to go to the details of the survey

00:28:15.989 --> 00:28:19.500
plan, but over the past couple of months uh with close

00:28:19.509 --> 00:28:23.670
coordinations with the rat team, LBNL uh reps. And

00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:26.479
Noy, we've been having a lot of discussions as to how

00:28:26.489 --> 00:28:29.979
to uh implement the survey uh effectively. And those

00:28:29.989 --> 00:28:33.289
discussions have been very, very helpful um as a result

00:28:33.299 --> 00:28:37.410
of those uh discussions and um our, our team which

00:28:37.420 --> 00:28:40.338
includes the Bridle Group and also plan beyond a market

00:28:40.348 --> 00:28:43.489
research firm which we have worked in the past. Um

00:28:43.500 --> 00:28:46.959
We put together a survey implementation plan to undertake

00:28:46.969 --> 00:28:51.209
the wall study. Um The survey implementation plan um

00:28:51.219 --> 00:28:56.250
has four components. The first part in a value of lo

00:28:56.348 --> 00:29:00.680
load survey is to develop effective uh survey instruments

00:29:00.969 --> 00:29:03.650
Uh We have been fortunate in the sense that we were

00:29:03.660 --> 00:29:08.568
leverage lbnls um long experience and expertise in

00:29:08.578 --> 00:29:12.334
this area. Uh So we are adopting their surveys, we

00:29:12.344 --> 00:29:16.334
will perhaps make uh a few modifications to directly

00:29:16.394 --> 00:29:19.535
be able to answer some of our cards, uh specific questions

00:29:19.545 --> 00:29:23.094
But to a large extent, we are planning to uh leverage

00:29:23.104 --> 00:29:27.394
lbnls uh survey instruments. So then um the second

00:29:27.404 --> 00:29:31.463
part is really uh the most challenging part. It's the

00:29:31.473 --> 00:29:34.779
survey implementation. It's challenging in the sense

00:29:34.789 --> 00:29:39.078
that ROT does not have a direct uh link with the customers

00:29:39.088 --> 00:29:43.578
Uh Oftentimes utilities under JD surveys, they have

00:29:43.588 --> 00:29:47.640
a lot of information um for their individual customers

00:29:47.650 --> 00:29:50.769
because they send the customers the bills. Uh but C

00:29:51.088 --> 00:29:54.479
does not directly have that um customer interface.

00:29:54.489 --> 00:29:57.979
So that makes the survey um challenging. And again

00:29:57.989 --> 00:30:00.098
we've been having a lot of conversations over the past

00:30:00.108 --> 00:30:05.368
couple of months. But our proposal is um to uh for

00:30:05.380 --> 00:30:09.439
residential and small CN I customers um to send these

00:30:09.449 --> 00:30:13.969
customers hopefully through CBC I information, um email

00:30:13.979 --> 00:30:17.489
uh hyperlinks to these surveys which will then their

00:30:17.500 --> 00:30:21.650
responses will go to pro pro priority um database uh

00:30:21.660 --> 00:30:24.969
to collect this information and for large customers

00:30:24.979 --> 00:30:29.108
which are again, um the more challenging class of customers

00:30:29.118 --> 00:30:33.059
to uh survey that uh we are also coordinating a few

00:30:33.068 --> 00:30:36.559
of the industry groups uh to hopefully execute the

00:30:36.568 --> 00:30:41.348
survey. Um So then in our work plan, we have also identified

00:30:41.358 --> 00:30:46.180
a few sources of potential bias and how we are planning

00:30:46.189 --> 00:30:50.578
to uh address these biases in every survey work. There

00:30:50.588 --> 00:30:54.459
is some amount of bias that um is inherent. The the

00:30:54.469 --> 00:30:57.439
first of all is um survey respondent bias. You know

00:30:57.449 --> 00:31:00.953
you send these surveys to a lot of customers, some

00:31:00.963 --> 00:31:03.703
of them respond and these respondents are likely to

00:31:03.713 --> 00:31:05.723
be different from the nonrespondent. So there are a

00:31:05.733 --> 00:31:09.344
few statistical techniques that could mitigate that

00:31:09.354 --> 00:31:12.625
which we will implement. But the other is what we are

00:31:12.634 --> 00:31:16.505
concerned about is that um you know, noise are not

00:31:16.515 --> 00:31:19.473
going to be part of the CBC I list as, as as

00:31:19.483 --> 00:31:24.000
Mr Arth mentioned um to the extent that no customers

00:31:24.009 --> 00:31:27.900
are different from uh com uh rep customers, the the

00:31:27.910 --> 00:31:31.000
the customers subject to competition, they would not

00:31:31.009 --> 00:31:34.118
be represented in the survey responses. If we don't

00:31:34.130 --> 00:31:37.588
have a way to uh survey these customers and given that

00:31:37.779 --> 00:31:41.125
a reliable to standard and other initiatives will be

00:31:41.134 --> 00:31:44.795
for all of the customers. Um In my personal opinion

00:31:44.805 --> 00:31:48.184
it would be very valuable to get some support, uh some

00:31:48.193 --> 00:31:51.654
representation of the no customers so that we can,

00:31:52.074 --> 00:31:55.670
you know, we're not talking about all noise, just a

00:31:55.680 --> 00:31:59.719
a, you know, a, a company, a, a group of noise so

00:31:59.729 --> 00:32:04.309
that we can post stratify and wait according to, to

00:32:04.318 --> 00:32:07.489
to get to a er a wide uh number at the end

00:32:07.500 --> 00:32:11.969
of the day. So that's um something to consider. And

00:32:11.979 --> 00:32:15.328
um last, but not least after we collect all this data

00:32:15.338 --> 00:32:20.459
we will implement uh sophisticated econometric uh techniques

00:32:20.469 --> 00:32:25.170
to glean customers, evaluation of uh lo load and report

00:32:25.180 --> 00:32:29.209
these by customer class by season by time of day. And

00:32:29.219 --> 00:32:32.598
again, any other granularity that uh we deem appropriate

00:32:32.608 --> 00:32:35.848
in consideration and conversations with A T and we

00:32:35.858 --> 00:32:40.904
will get to a wide value of lo node uh numbers. So

00:32:40.914 --> 00:32:43.364
I guess that's at a very high level how we are planning

00:32:43.375 --> 00:32:45.993
to implement. And one thing that I want to note is

00:32:46.005 --> 00:32:50.664
that we have laid out um a 24 mo uh weeks uh

00:32:50.674 --> 00:32:55.255
timeline for this um survey. We have budgeted for about

00:32:55.265 --> 00:32:59.505
13 weeks for the survey implementation uh from start

00:32:59.515 --> 00:33:04.900
to finish. And now we need that um other sort of 13

00:33:04.910 --> 00:33:07.689
weeks. So we have two overlapping weeks, weeks in which

00:33:07.699 --> 00:33:10.699
survey still is is ongoing. But we start some of the

00:33:10.709 --> 00:33:13.818
data processing for our econometric analysis. This

00:33:13.828 --> 00:33:17.858
timeline is um sort of extremely tight uh to begin

00:33:17.868 --> 00:33:21.449
with. Um So I wanna note that uh to the extent that

00:33:21.459 --> 00:33:25.098
there are any delays in um getting started with the

00:33:25.108 --> 00:33:28.709
survey effort, we would need to add that back to the

00:33:28.719 --> 00:33:31.838
schedule at the, at the tail end because unfortunately

00:33:31.848 --> 00:33:35.818
this is as compressed as it gets and, and we would

00:33:35.828 --> 00:33:39.400
not be comfortable rushing the economic analysis. Um

00:33:39.410 --> 00:33:42.578
And, and beyond that time that we budgeted for it.

00:33:43.608 --> 00:33:47.469
So I'm, I'm happy to answer any questions you may have

00:33:49.160 --> 00:33:51.219
and sorry, I was just going to add one more thing that

00:33:51.229 --> 00:33:53.779
I forgot to add before we're, we're happy to say that

00:33:53.789 --> 00:33:56.338
um Texas and I'm authorized to represent the Texas

00:33:56.348 --> 00:33:58.789
Industrial energy consumers, the Texas Oil and Gas

00:33:58.799 --> 00:34:01.640
Association and the Energy Professional Association

00:34:01.650 --> 00:34:05.199
have all um partnered with us to help distribute survey

00:34:05.209 --> 00:34:08.860
to um the large customers. And uh and I understand

00:34:08.869 --> 00:34:13.070
that in, in many instances, brokers have um uh the

00:34:13.079 --> 00:34:15.750
kind of email relationship with the customer and so

00:34:15.760 --> 00:34:18.128
they can help us out um particularly with those small

00:34:18.139 --> 00:34:20.349
and medium commercial, commercial customers.

00:34:22.137 --> 00:34:24.318
So I know that commission staff recommends that the

00:34:24.329 --> 00:34:27.539
commission accept ERCOT S proposal to use option three

00:34:27.829 --> 00:34:31.478
to conduct the BAL survey. Uh I agree with staff. Do

00:34:31.489 --> 00:34:34.467
we have any thoughts? I agree as well. And, and I,

00:34:34.478 --> 00:34:36.958
and I want to thank ERCOT and, and Bridle for their

00:34:36.967 --> 00:34:39.708
work on this. And it's clear to me that this is gonna

00:34:39.717 --> 00:34:43.579
be a very robust, um great effort to come up with a

00:34:43.588 --> 00:34:46.197
whole study that will help inform our reliability standard

00:34:46.208 --> 00:34:49.929
I'm supportive of option three and um also would like

00:34:49.938 --> 00:34:54.139
to encourage some Noy to partner with ERCOT um to get

00:34:54.148 --> 00:34:55.918
information from their service territories because

00:34:55.929 --> 00:34:59.019
I think it would be beneficial for ERCOT to have that

00:34:59.030 --> 00:35:01.668
information since we have a lot of noy and big noy

00:35:02.059 --> 00:35:06.219
in um in Texas, um some big uh mo us and, and

00:35:06.228 --> 00:35:08.458
co ops and would also request that the competitive

00:35:08.469 --> 00:35:11.929
reps include email addresses and their CBC I files

00:35:11.938 --> 00:35:13.728
in January and February if possible because that will

00:35:13.739 --> 00:35:19.128
help ERCOT outreach to more customers um via email

00:35:19.139 --> 00:35:21.728
And so, um thank you again, I think this is moving

00:35:21.739 --> 00:35:23.188
in a very good direction.

00:35:24.809 --> 00:35:28.750
I'll follow up on that. I agree that staff laid out

00:35:28.760 --> 00:35:32.500
Option three very well in their memo adheres to the

00:35:32.510 --> 00:35:36.228
law. It's in my opinion, the best path forward. I would

00:35:36.239 --> 00:35:39.458
just encourage you all to look when you are looking

00:35:39.469 --> 00:35:43.489
at. Nay, don't just take city of Austin and city of

00:35:43.500 --> 00:35:46.869
San Antonio. Look to the rural areas of the state.

00:35:46.878 --> 00:35:49.878
They have a voice in this and it needs to be heard

00:35:49.889 --> 00:35:52.340
in the study as well. So I just encourage you to make

00:35:52.349 --> 00:35:55.039
the extra effort if, if that information doesn't get

00:35:55.050 --> 00:35:57.079
returned the first time, you can always come back to

00:35:57.090 --> 00:36:00.849
us or we'll help you find a way to, to get their

00:36:00.860 --> 00:36:04.599
voice heard in this, in this study. Thanks. I know

00:36:04.610 --> 00:36:08.619
Matt presented at both R MS and tact this month requesting

00:36:08.628 --> 00:36:10.579
that participation. And I think we're also issuing

00:36:10.590 --> 00:36:14.458
a market notice to encourage no precip as well.

00:36:16.369 --> 00:36:18.469
So I think I'm hearing that each of you are satisfied

00:36:18.478 --> 00:36:21.679
with option three. ERCOT, do you need anything else

00:36:21.688 --> 00:36:24.188
from us before moving forward? Rebecca?

00:36:26.489 --> 00:36:30.550
Um I don't believe so. Uh uh We appreciate y'all's

00:36:30.559 --> 00:36:34.840
feedback and I continue to work with staff on the survey

00:36:34.849 --> 00:36:37.860
moving forward. And just so I'm on the record. I support

00:36:37.869 --> 00:36:40.179
that as well. Um I'm just glad to see Brattle on the

00:36:40.188 --> 00:36:42.719
field. Finally, I know the timeline is extremely tight

00:36:43.050 --> 00:36:48.570
Uh glad, very gratified to see um industrial users

00:36:48.699 --> 00:36:51.938
and other industry participants playing ball because

00:36:51.949 --> 00:36:54.760
this is an essential component for both ERCOT and other

00:36:54.769 --> 00:36:57.019
systems that are evaluating what the value of scarcity

00:36:57.030 --> 00:36:59.489
truly needs to be moving forward. So, thank you to

00:36:59.550 --> 00:37:03.969
ERCOT. Good plan. This is going to be a bright, a shining

00:37:03.978 --> 00:37:06.889
light for ERCOT who's blazing a path that others will

00:37:06.898 --> 00:37:11.148
follow. So very appreciative. Thank you. Um Again,

00:37:11.159 --> 00:37:13.438
also important to note that we'd like to have input

00:37:13.449 --> 00:37:17.228
from all Texans in response to the survey. Again, not

00:37:17.239 --> 00:37:19.349
just those that are served by the reps. So I'd urge

00:37:19.418 --> 00:37:21.938
ERCOT and staff to continue to work with Armenis and

00:37:21.949 --> 00:37:24.938
Co ops to get participation from their customers as

00:37:24.949 --> 00:37:26.469
well as we talked about earlier.

00:37:28.398 --> 00:37:33.309
Ok, thank you. Um I don't have anything on item 17

00:37:33.320 --> 00:37:39.429
or 18. Next up is item number 19. Project number 53710

00:37:39.438 --> 00:37:42.079
this is the commission's project for the project monitor

00:37:42.090 --> 00:37:46.389
distribution and usage of pure Chapter 39 chapter N

00:37:46.398 --> 00:37:49.179
proceeds. Sheila, do we have anyone from the public

00:37:49.188 --> 00:37:52.139
signed up to speak on item 19? No, ma'am.

00:37:53.769 --> 00:37:56.918
Staff filed a memo providing the final update regarding

00:37:56.929 --> 00:37:59.438
the distribution of the bond proceeds and is here to

00:37:59.449 --> 00:38:01.119
provide a brief overview.

00:38:02.978 --> 00:38:05.159
Good morning commissioners. Zachary Dollar for commission

00:38:05.168 --> 00:38:08.039
Staff, commission. Staff's memo is the fifth and final

00:38:08.050 --> 00:38:09.938
update regarding the distribution and monitoring of

00:38:09.949 --> 00:38:13.929
sub chapter and security station bond proceeds L CS

00:38:13.938 --> 00:38:15.619
with the remaining subchapter and bond proceeds were

00:38:15.628 --> 00:38:17.849
required to file a final status report on November

00:38:17.860 --> 00:38:21.019
15th. Staff's memo included a summary table based on

00:38:21.030 --> 00:38:23.918
their filings, there were only six L CS with funds

00:38:23.929 --> 00:38:27.398
not distributed to customers totaling just over $78,000

00:38:27.989 --> 00:38:30.090
All funds were attempted to be returned to customers

00:38:30.099 --> 00:38:32.659
by check but were never cashed despite the efforts

00:38:32.668 --> 00:38:34.869
of the remaining six LLC S to reach these customers

00:38:36.269 --> 00:38:40.840
all of the remaining $78,000 in return, staff believes

00:38:40.849 --> 00:38:43.199
each LLC use reasonable effort to locate and issue

00:38:43.208 --> 00:38:45.918
refunds to their eligible active and inactive customers

00:38:46.398 --> 00:38:48.599
Commission staff recommends that the commission deem

00:38:48.610 --> 00:38:51.719
all LLC obligations regarding the distribution of subchapter

00:38:51.728 --> 00:38:54.010
and bond proceeds to be fully discharged. And that

00:38:54.019 --> 00:38:57.398
project number 537 10, be closed. Thank you. And I'm

00:38:57.409 --> 00:39:00.159
happy to answer any questions. Thank you. Any thoughts

00:39:00.168 --> 00:39:03.789
on this one? I think they proposed the right thing

00:39:03.840 --> 00:39:08.030
I think reducing the uplift is the way to go with these

00:39:08.039 --> 00:39:09.398
dollars that can't be

00:39:12.329 --> 00:39:15.860
assigned to or, or checks cashed, assigned to an individual

00:39:16.398 --> 00:39:19.659
and think that they've done the right thing and I'm

00:39:19.668 --> 00:39:22.429
supportive of that effort if we need to draft an order

00:39:22.438 --> 00:39:28.570
or is there a? Um Anyway, I would entertain a motion

00:39:28.579 --> 00:39:31.809
to approve staff's recommendation, deeming all LSE

00:39:31.820 --> 00:39:34.659
obligations regarding the distribution of subchapter

00:39:34.668 --> 00:39:38.360
in bond proceeds to be fully discharged. And that project

00:39:38.369 --> 00:39:42.769
number 53710 be closed. I would also direct PUC C staff

00:39:42.780 --> 00:39:45.128
to draft an order consistent with the commission's

00:39:45.139 --> 00:39:50.148
decision. So I have a motion and a second all in favor

00:39:50.159 --> 00:39:56.648
Say I I motion passes. Thanks. Next up is item number

00:39:56.659 --> 00:40:00.648
20 project number 53911. This is the commission's project

00:40:00.659 --> 00:40:03.769
for the aggregate distributed Energy Resources ERCOT

00:40:03.780 --> 00:40:06.610
pilot project. See, do we have anyone from the public

00:40:06.619 --> 00:40:10.750
signed up to speak on item number 20? No, ma'am. Commissioners

00:40:10.760 --> 00:40:14.739
McAdams and Glotfelty filed a joint memo. Could you

00:40:14.750 --> 00:40:19.208
please lay out your memo? Thank you madam chair on

00:40:19.219 --> 00:40:22.148
behalf of Commissioner Glotfelty and myself, we we

00:40:22.159 --> 00:40:26.869
filed a memo basically reflecting a continuance of

00:40:26.878 --> 00:40:30.389
the conversation that we had at the August 24th open

00:40:30.398 --> 00:40:34.500
meeting. We asked the task force to discuss pathways

00:40:34.510 --> 00:40:39.539
to expand participation in the AD pilot. And over the

00:40:39.550 --> 00:40:42.418
last months, the task force has held multiple meetings

00:40:42.429 --> 00:40:45.349
to identify barriers to participation as highlighted

00:40:45.360 --> 00:40:50.389
in the memo among the possible actions ERCOT has and

00:40:50.398 --> 00:40:55.679
I believe this is accurate, has agreed that we should

00:40:55.688 --> 00:41:00.110
allow ADRS to qualify for ecs. Thank you, Rebecca approach

00:41:00.929 --> 00:41:04.599
We also, they also believe it is appropriate to update

00:41:04.610 --> 00:41:09.938
the telemetry validation methodology which can be codified

00:41:09.949 --> 00:41:13.760
in the governing document and to clarify the procedures

00:41:13.769 --> 00:41:16.628
for checking for enrollment in other programs such

00:41:16.639 --> 00:41:23.070
as si I would say tomorrow is a the final meeting of

00:41:23.079 --> 00:41:26.849
the ADER task force for the year. I'd like to ask the

00:41:26.860 --> 00:41:30.969
task force to bring, to make all effort to bring more

00:41:31.010 --> 00:41:36.478
non non opt-in entities noy into the conversation of

00:41:36.489 --> 00:41:39.929
ADR participation, unlocking the business case for

00:41:39.938 --> 00:41:43.168
noy will be a great benefit to the state. It will serve

00:41:43.179 --> 00:41:48.059
those rural areas and underserved areas in terms of

00:41:48.070 --> 00:41:51.769
a lot of technical capabilities, technological capabilities

00:41:52.119 --> 00:41:54.708
and we encourage our coin task force to continue working

00:41:54.719 --> 00:41:58.510
together to provide, to continue the momentum on the

00:41:58.590 --> 00:42:02.449
ADR pilot moving forward and expand it as quickly as

00:42:02.458 --> 00:42:08.679
is practicable madam chair. Just to close on my layout

00:42:09.300 --> 00:42:12.059
I believe this has been a significant success for Texas

00:42:12.070 --> 00:42:15.159
We have demonstrated that we are still in the most

00:42:15.168 --> 00:42:19.300
innovative and dynamic system in the country and that

00:42:19.309 --> 00:42:22.610
this is going to be a resource that the system should

00:42:22.619 --> 00:42:25.800
be able to truly depend on in the future and will help

00:42:25.809 --> 00:42:29.500
resiliency help to make the system more reliable and

00:42:29.510 --> 00:42:33.159
resilient in extreme situations. With that, I would

00:42:33.168 --> 00:42:40.398
welcome any comments. I would like to add that this

00:42:41.139 --> 00:42:44.269
this ADER task force I think has been a has been a

00:42:44.280 --> 00:42:52.320
success in knocking down barriers to the understanding

00:42:52.329 --> 00:42:55.438
of value of ads and virtual power plants in the state

00:42:56.168 --> 00:42:58.789
We have not yet achieved the potential of what these

00:42:58.800 --> 00:43:04.090
things can do this step, expanding ECR S and other

00:43:04.099 --> 00:43:08.978
products is critical and it's not critical, it's critical

00:43:08.989 --> 00:43:12.389
if we want to grow these into major reliability tools

00:43:12.889 --> 00:43:16.610
That's because the the retail providers and the others

00:43:16.619 --> 00:43:20.750
that are creating V PS need critical mass that they

00:43:20.760 --> 00:43:24.610
can go market to and have critical mass of products

00:43:24.619 --> 00:43:28.760
they can sell into otherwise they're spending marketing

00:43:28.769 --> 00:43:31.570
dollars on just a few customers and we're not going

00:43:31.579 --> 00:43:36.030
to get the value out of it. So expanding this is, I

00:43:36.039 --> 00:43:39.389
think absolutely the right thing to do it. It will

00:43:39.599 --> 00:43:47.070
be our kind of our net metering tool for these resources

00:43:47.079 --> 00:43:50.389
As we go forward, they are playing in a wholesale market

00:43:50.398 --> 00:43:54.978
and they are helping the reliability of the system

00:43:54.989 --> 00:43:57.889
And I think as we grow this, it will continue to grow

00:43:57.898 --> 00:44:02.019
across the state. And I'm happy to have my name on

00:44:02.030 --> 00:44:05.800
the memo with you. I would also point out commissioner

00:44:05.809 --> 00:44:10.878
and echo those comments. One of the important outcomes

00:44:10.889 --> 00:44:13.958
of this is we need to see the density produced from

00:44:13.969 --> 00:44:17.929
the pilot uh geographic density so that the infrastructure

00:44:18.099 --> 00:44:20.969
of our grid may be built out to better accommodate

00:44:20.978 --> 00:44:26.260
this more diffuse and uh and and prevalent capability

00:44:26.340 --> 00:44:29.179
in our system, especially as technology improves and

00:44:29.188 --> 00:44:32.869
consumers see the value associated with this, this

00:44:32.878 --> 00:44:37.269
technology that they could deploy. Yeah, I I just wanna

00:44:37.280 --> 00:44:39.869
congratulate both of y'all on your work on this um

00:44:39.878 --> 00:44:43.628
ad R project. I mean, it's been really um cutting edge

00:44:43.639 --> 00:44:46.659
nationally globally. I think in terms of just innovation

00:44:46.668 --> 00:44:50.840
showing um that we continue to lead in innovation in

00:44:50.849 --> 00:44:54.610
in Texas, in ERCOT. Um And it's awesome that now we're

00:44:54.619 --> 00:44:57.349
moving to the next chapter of expansion into another

00:44:57.429 --> 00:45:00.708
ancillary service. And you know, I'm glad ERCOT supportive

00:45:00.719 --> 00:45:03.119
and I know there will be changes to the governing documents

00:45:03.128 --> 00:45:04.800
that will be presented to the board. And so I think

00:45:04.809 --> 00:45:08.300
this is moving in a great direction and congratulations

00:45:08.309 --> 00:45:12.389
on both of y'all and, and you know, Commissioner McAdams

00:45:12.398 --> 00:45:15.010
you know, your leadership on this has been outstanding

00:45:15.019 --> 00:45:17.449
and I think this is a model for other markets in the

00:45:17.458 --> 00:45:20.019
United States. So your new wing man over here is going

00:45:20.030 --> 00:45:20.829
to be carrying the baton,

00:45:22.780 --> 00:45:24.519
Jimmy will be carrying the baton going forward and

00:45:24.530 --> 00:45:27.269
I'm sure it will be such robust memos.

00:45:31.059 --> 00:45:33.349
We'll just appreciate the leadership from both of y'all

00:45:33.360 --> 00:45:36.449
and knowing that this is moving forward. Um You know

00:45:36.458 --> 00:45:38.688
it's, it's not one big answer. It's a lot of little

00:45:38.699 --> 00:45:41.539
answers and it's things that support the system overall

00:45:41.550 --> 00:45:44.688
in terms of reliability, resiliency, and affordability

00:45:44.699 --> 00:45:48.610
and this definitely hits on all of those objectives

00:45:48.619 --> 00:45:50.909
So I if if I could madam chair before you close it

00:45:50.918 --> 00:45:53.309
out, I would like to personally thank before I am no

00:45:53.320 --> 00:45:57.719
longer heard from again, c staff for, for your willingness

00:45:57.728 --> 00:46:03.019
to embrace this new capability, study it and take those

00:46:03.030 --> 00:46:06.550
steps and support taking those steps that allow the

00:46:06.559 --> 00:46:10.360
grid to evolve and grow this. This is going to be neat

00:46:10.369 --> 00:46:12.978
to watch in the years to come and we were there on

00:46:12.989 --> 00:46:15.579
the ground floor. So thanks, thanks Rebecca, thanks

00:46:15.599 --> 00:46:19.918
Dan. We, we presenting our draft report on phase one

00:46:19.938 --> 00:46:24.429
at the task force tomorrow. It should make the recommendation

00:46:24.438 --> 00:46:28.128
for phase two to include CRS and that will cover the

00:46:28.139 --> 00:46:31.969
August 24th through November 30th of this year. I think

00:46:31.978 --> 00:46:35.329
the phase two governing document recommendation would

00:46:35.340 --> 00:46:37.753
be available for the task force after the for review

00:46:37.764 --> 00:46:40.284
moving towards that February board approval. Really

00:46:40.293 --> 00:46:43.083
appreciate that. And I know I know you wanted to thank

00:46:43.094 --> 00:46:46.304
Tiffany for writing for the help of the memo. She was

00:46:46.313 --> 00:46:50.014
the tip of the spear on this and from my standpoint

00:46:50.023 --> 00:46:51.965
I've got to find my Tiffany now.

00:46:53.969 --> 00:46:57.559
Well, that doe fellowship program was a, a great loner

00:46:57.570 --> 00:47:00.789
program. Best thing the feds ever did

00:47:05.329 --> 00:47:09.760
with that, we will move forward. Ok. I don't have anything

00:47:09.769 --> 00:47:14.789
on item 2021 unless y'all do. Uh next up is item number

00:47:14.800 --> 00:47:19.188
22. Project number 54444. This is the commission's

00:47:19.199 --> 00:47:23.010
project for ERCOT S calendar year 2023 reports. Sheila

00:47:23.019 --> 00:47:25.110
do we have anyone from the public signed up to speak

00:47:25.119 --> 00:47:29.079
on item number 22 ma'am. Uh Today we will discuss the

00:47:29.090 --> 00:47:32.829
final report ERCOT filed and uh addressing the September

00:47:32.840 --> 00:47:37.929
6th 2023 emergency event. Um Dan with him from ERCOT

00:47:38.219 --> 00:47:41.679
is here. Um Dan, if you would come up and provide an

00:47:41.688 --> 00:47:45.418
overview of ERCOT S report and please state your name

00:47:45.429 --> 00:47:51.300
for the record DM with and with got um, so we did

00:47:51.309 --> 00:47:55.019
file a, a unredacted confidential report with, for

00:47:55.030 --> 00:47:57.708
the commission to review as well as a redacted public

00:47:57.719 --> 00:48:00.878
version because it the difference was primarily due

00:48:00.889 --> 00:48:03.809
to some of the uh critical energy infrastructure uh

00:48:03.820 --> 00:48:07.539
information that had to be in there. Um at a high level

00:48:07.550 --> 00:48:10.300
the, the report provides details that are consistent

00:48:10.309 --> 00:48:14.159
with what I uh gave you back at soon after the event

00:48:14.168 --> 00:48:17.269
and the verbal report at an open meeting. The one thing

00:48:17.280 --> 00:48:22.219
that is new is that we issued an RF to entities that

00:48:22.228 --> 00:48:25.110
were contributing to our physical responsive capability

00:48:25.119 --> 00:48:29.139
that that part of reserves that is frequency responsive

00:48:29.260 --> 00:48:32.458
And we had reason to believe that that because frequency

00:48:32.469 --> 00:48:35.030
went low, although we still have a significant amount

00:48:35.039 --> 00:48:39.559
of PRC the physical responsive capability that, that

00:48:40.250 --> 00:48:42.559
the information that we were getting from the market

00:48:42.570 --> 00:48:44.909
participants in order to provide to calculate that

00:48:44.918 --> 00:48:47.708
PR C number was probably too high. So we issued the

00:48:47.719 --> 00:48:50.389
RF I. So one of the things I want to report on

00:48:50.398 --> 00:48:54.010
today is kind of the talk more about the results of

00:48:54.019 --> 00:48:57.469
that RF I because we didn't know about that at the

00:48:57.478 --> 00:49:00.289
time that I gave the previous open meeting uh presentation

00:49:00.639 --> 00:49:04.458
Um So I guess the summary is at the point of lowest

00:49:04.469 --> 00:49:09.168
frequency, the um the PR C that was being calculated

00:49:09.179 --> 00:49:13.579
was about 564 megawatts higher than what it should

00:49:13.590 --> 00:49:17.070
have been at the time. Um And the, the breakdown of

00:49:17.079 --> 00:49:20.898
of what was causing that, that um PR C to be calculation

00:49:20.909 --> 00:49:24.199
to be too high is we had about 200 megawatts, a little

00:49:24.208 --> 00:49:29.438
under 200 megawatts of uh reported cap capacity from

00:49:29.449 --> 00:49:32.780
thermal generators. This is on page four of the report

00:49:32.789 --> 00:49:35.639
By the way, if you got it, um, the, um, there are

00:49:35.648 --> 00:49:38.989
about a little under 200 megawatts from thermal generators

00:49:39.000 --> 00:49:42.389
that were reporting that they could get to a higher

00:49:42.398 --> 00:49:44.820
capacity than what they could actually get to at that

00:49:44.829 --> 00:49:50.369
point in time. And uh most of that is, is just single

00:49:50.469 --> 00:49:53.789
digit megawatts because they were assuming that it

00:49:53.800 --> 00:49:56.369
was uh the amount of capacity you can get out of a

00:49:56.378 --> 00:50:00.269
thermal unit is largely, is somewhat dependent on ambient

00:50:00.280 --> 00:50:03.329
air temperatures. And so that there's always a little

00:50:03.389 --> 00:50:06.949
little bit of error there. Um We actually passed N

00:50:06.958 --> 00:50:11.949
pr 1085 last year that, that sets rules around how

00:50:11.958 --> 00:50:15.349
accurate those the reporting has to be. And so no,

00:50:15.360 --> 00:50:19.378
uh no one was in violation of that N pr 1085 that

00:50:19.389 --> 00:50:24.159
we've seen at this point. Um The uh the next category

00:50:24.168 --> 00:50:28.659
was a little over 200 megawatts from wind generation

00:50:28.668 --> 00:50:33.918
resources that their controls, if they're curtailed

00:50:33.929 --> 00:50:37.300
then they have to be able to respond to frequency and

00:50:37.309 --> 00:50:40.010
increase their output if their control systems are

00:50:40.019 --> 00:50:42.559
set up, right. That happens automatically. But in this

00:50:42.570 --> 00:50:45.309
case, it didn't seem to be working, right. And so we're

00:50:45.320 --> 00:50:49.079
actually working with all of those different wind generators

00:50:49.090 --> 00:50:51.878
to look at their control system and see if they can

00:50:51.889 --> 00:50:55.219
make the changes that would allow them to provide frequency

00:50:55.228 --> 00:50:59.619
response in, in, in a similar situation. And then the

00:50:59.628 --> 00:51:04.349
final category is 158 megawatts that was from uh energy

00:51:04.360 --> 00:51:08.898
storage resources that were uh largely the, the biggest

00:51:08.909 --> 00:51:11.728
category of those that they were reporting that they

00:51:11.739 --> 00:51:14.978
could get us to a certain output. But because they

00:51:14.989 --> 00:51:17.909
had depleted their state of charge significantly, it

00:51:17.918 --> 00:51:20.300
gets harder and harder to get juice out of the battery

00:51:20.309 --> 00:51:22.978
when, when they're at a very low state of charge. And

00:51:22.989 --> 00:51:26.429
so they couldn't actually get there. And so, uh that

00:51:26.438 --> 00:51:29.800
that's one where we're working on uh, rules around

00:51:29.809 --> 00:51:33.360
Uh, we may need to make some rule changes to, to or

00:51:33.369 --> 00:51:37.050
or systems changes, one or the other to, to account

00:51:37.059 --> 00:51:39.378
for that, especially as we get more and more batteries

00:51:39.389 --> 00:51:42.559
on the system. And so that's really the, the, the primary

00:51:42.570 --> 00:51:44.539
things that I wanted to report on that, that like I

00:51:44.550 --> 00:51:46.918
said is different from the previous report, but I'm

00:51:46.929 --> 00:51:49.889
happy to answer any questions you might have on anything

00:51:49.898 --> 00:51:50.719
in the report.

00:51:55.789 --> 00:51:59.489
Yeah, I, I'm appreciative of the report and the extra

00:51:59.500 --> 00:52:03.530
time to look at it. I still,

00:52:05.769 --> 00:52:09.349
I think these are things that, that we reports like

00:52:09.360 --> 00:52:11.929
this. Unfortunately, I think are things that are going

00:52:11.938 --> 00:52:13.648
to be more normal than not,

00:52:15.369 --> 00:52:18.550
at least until the, the transmission line from the

00:52:18.559 --> 00:52:23.269
south gets completed and some of the reliability issues

00:52:23.280 --> 00:52:28.030
get resolved long term. I hope this is a lesson. I

00:52:28.039 --> 00:52:31.699
I'm, I, when I look at the data, I see it, I

00:52:31.708 --> 00:52:34.398
read it differently than you all do. Um I would have

00:52:34.409 --> 00:52:38.099
a different headline, I would have a different um uh

00:52:38.550 --> 00:52:38.708
uh

00:52:40.280 --> 00:52:44.679
I would write the report a little differently, so I'm

00:52:44.688 --> 00:52:48.300
not going to pick, pick at that. I just think that

00:52:48.590 --> 00:52:51.750
we know this is a constraint. We know this is a problem

00:52:51.760 --> 00:52:56.860
Now, we know that when I think when you have high thermal

00:52:56.869 --> 00:53:00.500
problems in the North, something like this is possible

00:53:00.510 --> 00:53:03.978
to happen. And I hope we can look at all of the

00:53:03.989 --> 00:53:11.139
possible remedies to solve this utilizing market functions

00:53:11.148 --> 00:53:17.039
first rather than operator actions. And, and hopefully

00:53:17.050 --> 00:53:20.289
we can keep prices down and continue to encourage the

00:53:20.300 --> 00:53:23.090
market to function as opposed to the operators taking

00:53:23.099 --> 00:53:26.969
these, these actions. I think the other thing that

00:53:26.978 --> 00:53:29.329
it showed me was that

00:53:31.378 --> 00:53:34.869
and this is, this is kind of scary. We at this commission

00:53:34.878 --> 00:53:43.030
moved s to be deployed prior to getting into EES and

00:53:43.039 --> 00:53:44.929
that leaves the cupboard pretty bare

00:53:46.559 --> 00:53:51.878
when you get into an ee if you don't have tools because

00:53:51.889 --> 00:53:56.050
you've already deployed them to prevent you getting

00:53:56.059 --> 00:53:59.280
into ee then the coverage bear the way I see it. The

00:53:59.289 --> 00:54:02.139
question becomes to ERCOT, how do we fill that in?

00:54:02.208 --> 00:54:06.079
What is, what are the tools that we need to do if

00:54:06.090 --> 00:54:09.458
we do real time call optimization? Do we need to take

00:54:09.590 --> 00:54:13.699
er s and put it back into eea the last resort. I

00:54:13.708 --> 00:54:15.510
mean, I think those are the discussions we need to

00:54:15.519 --> 00:54:18.139
have with ancillary service with a big study that we're

00:54:18.148 --> 00:54:21.760
going to do and have the, the market input. Because

00:54:22.159 --> 00:54:24.418
while we don't want, we want to use the tools not to

00:54:24.429 --> 00:54:27.148
get into eea, we also got to have something there when

00:54:27.159 --> 00:54:30.619
we get into it. So, and that, that was an apparent

00:54:30.628 --> 00:54:35.909
apparent to me. So I hope that we can continue to work

00:54:35.918 --> 00:54:38.260
through this. I asked Woody some questions about this

00:54:38.418 --> 00:54:41.099
about the numbers of thermal outages in the north.

00:54:41.110 --> 00:54:44.719
How big of a problem actually was that? And he said

00:54:44.728 --> 00:54:47.739
he'd get back to me. So, so actually I have an answer

00:54:47.750 --> 00:54:52.679
to that. So if we looked at the number of thermal outages

00:54:52.688 --> 00:54:57.039
on that at I earning 20 on that afternoon of the six

00:54:57.050 --> 00:55:01.119
it was about a little under 5900 megawatts. That's

00:55:01.128 --> 00:55:04.199
about the same number. It was on the following day

00:55:04.500 --> 00:55:07.469
It actually had been higher on the day before and,

00:55:07.478 --> 00:55:11.878
and earlier in the morning on the sixth. So we actually

00:55:11.889 --> 00:55:15.844
the outage kind of went down in the afternoon, the

00:55:15.853 --> 00:55:18.114
amount of forest outages on thermal generation had

00:55:18.125 --> 00:55:22.603
gone down in the afternoon before the event from what

00:55:22.614 --> 00:55:25.175
they had been the day before and the morning before

00:55:25.333 --> 00:55:28.155
and were all those in the north or were they was that

00:55:28.164 --> 00:55:33.628
system the, the, I guess the increase had, had gone

00:55:33.639 --> 00:55:37.059
up in both the north and the south and then they both

00:55:37.070 --> 00:55:40.878
kind of came down proportionally. I just again, something

00:55:40.889 --> 00:55:43.750
that we need to, your operators, your folks need to

00:55:43.760 --> 00:55:46.878
keep an eye on, I think is important as we go forward

00:55:46.978 --> 00:55:51.739
Thank you. Um Dan, one highlight on page six of the

00:55:51.750 --> 00:55:54.659
report, you said it was the highest instantaneous net

00:55:54.668 --> 00:55:58.570
load in ERCOT history that just stood out to me. Can

00:55:58.579 --> 00:56:01.228
you, can you touch on that a little bit? Yeah. So the

00:56:01.239 --> 00:56:06.239
the the the net load is kind of the instantaneous amount

00:56:06.250 --> 00:56:09.958
of the the maximum consumption that we have from all

00:56:09.969 --> 00:56:13.688
the electricity consumers minus the amount that's being

00:56:13.780 --> 00:56:16.809
of that load that's being provided by wind and solar

00:56:16.820 --> 00:56:19.989
resources. And so the way, the way to look at that

00:56:20.000 --> 00:56:23.179
net load number is that's the, that's the load that

00:56:23.188 --> 00:56:27.909
the dispatchable generation has to serve. And so basically

00:56:27.918 --> 00:56:30.978
what that comment is saying is that's the maximum amount

00:56:30.989 --> 00:56:35.010
that the dispatchable fleet had ever had to serve on

00:56:35.019 --> 00:56:39.409
the ERCOT system. Uh If you, if you look back at, at

00:56:39.418 --> 00:56:43.329
a time before wind and solar resources were added to

00:56:43.340 --> 00:56:45.938
the system that we typically reported on the peak demand

00:56:45.949 --> 00:56:48.320
the maximum consumption and that whatever the maximum

00:56:48.329 --> 00:56:51.360
peak demand was, that was the time that the dispatchable

00:56:51.369 --> 00:56:55.510
generation was needed the most. Well, in this case

00:56:55.519 --> 00:56:58.889
it's it's shifted to where it's really the net load

00:56:58.898 --> 00:57:02.378
is what they're providing. And so that's kind of says

00:57:02.389 --> 00:57:05.889
that's the most we've ever needed. And is that driven

00:57:05.898 --> 00:57:08.728
or, or mainly focused that net load period that you're

00:57:08.739 --> 00:57:12.500
highlighting in the solar ram down that because solar

00:57:12.510 --> 00:57:15.500
was going away, that would I think it was consistent

00:57:15.510 --> 00:57:17.929
with that not being there to help.

00:57:19.668 --> 00:57:22.619
So the the dispatchable generation had to ramp up to

00:57:22.628 --> 00:57:25.280
to cover what? Because the load was staying fairly

00:57:25.289 --> 00:57:28.809
constant at that point in time. And so as the solar

00:57:28.820 --> 00:57:31.429
ramped down, the dispatchable generation had to ramp

00:57:31.438 --> 00:57:35.309
up um to help serve the load. Yeah, it was still hot

00:57:35.320 --> 00:57:39.929
at night. And so you still had high demand on the system

00:57:40.340 --> 00:57:42.809
We just have a whole lot more, we have wind, but we

00:57:42.820 --> 00:57:45.918
have a whole lot more solar. So is the expectation

00:57:45.929 --> 00:57:49.320
that the net load, um the peak net load will get steeper

00:57:49.329 --> 00:57:52.239
and that's sort of the going forward expectation of

00:57:52.250 --> 00:57:56.039
what we had in the summer there. It's definitely true

00:57:56.050 --> 00:58:00.250
that um when the peak load on the system happens, the

00:58:00.260 --> 00:58:03.639
peak peak consumption in the heat of the afternoon

00:58:03.648 --> 00:58:06.728
that typically is going to be around 5 p.m. or so in

00:58:07.168 --> 00:58:10.168
the summer, the sun's going to be helping. So as we

00:58:10.179 --> 00:58:13.188
get more solar on the system, it's going to help a

00:58:13.199 --> 00:58:16.719
lot sir. As the load continues to grow with the great

00:58:16.728 --> 00:58:20.340
Texas economy and so forth. But then when the sun goes

00:58:20.349 --> 00:58:23.699
away at night, it won't be, the solar will not be there

00:58:23.708 --> 00:58:26.099
to help and we'll need more dispatchable generation

00:58:26.110 --> 00:58:29.860
to help or, and, and I guess it is dispatchable generation

00:58:29.869 --> 00:58:34.510
I'm including batteries in that as, as being what we

00:58:34.519 --> 00:58:37.750
will need to tide us over until in the evening. Then

00:58:37.760 --> 00:58:41.300
the load tends to come down. Sure. So the net peak

00:58:41.309 --> 00:58:43.590
load period will become even more critical as we have

00:58:43.599 --> 00:58:45.530
more solar on the system, we have that ramp down and

00:58:45.539 --> 00:58:47.489
we're gonna need dispatchable resources to fill that

00:58:47.500 --> 00:58:51.418
ramp down as you highlighted um traditional generation

00:58:51.429 --> 00:58:58.688
and batteries. Ok, thanks Dan. Um Do you have a picture

00:58:59.070 --> 00:59:04.530
So state of charge a little bit um on, on how on

00:59:04.539 --> 00:59:11.300
how we observed state of charge post ee A and, and

00:59:11.309 --> 00:59:15.750
going into the event, we, we noted that one state of

00:59:15.760 --> 00:59:18.728
charge indicated that

00:59:20.320 --> 00:59:24.898
I'm trying to figure out, do you have a a picture on

00:59:24.909 --> 00:59:29.559
once curtailment happened in the south, how much state

00:59:29.570 --> 00:59:36.219
of charge energy was, was isolated in the South and

00:59:36.228 --> 00:59:39.449
basically remained? And then how much in the north

00:59:39.458 --> 00:59:43.769
was basically the entire capacity of state of charge

00:59:43.780 --> 00:59:48.079
in the north depleted over the high-risk hours or high-risk

00:59:48.090 --> 00:59:52.820
moments of September 6th. How did the ratio bear out

00:59:52.829 --> 00:59:56.478
Do we, do we have a picture on that? I don't think

00:59:56.489 --> 00:59:59.179
we've got it broken out into those two pieces. There

00:59:59.188 --> 01:00:03.889
is on page 18 A a uh kind of AAA graphic that

01:00:03.898 --> 01:00:07.429
shows the uh state of charge for the all the batteries

01:00:07.438 --> 01:00:10.418
but we don't have it broken out. So I I'm just wondering

01:00:10.429 --> 01:00:14.969
this, this was a combination of events that, that came

01:00:14.978 --> 01:00:19.478
to a confluence at one time, it was a disruption caused

01:00:19.489 --> 01:00:24.090
by an overloaded point of the transmission system that

01:00:24.099 --> 01:00:27.360
caused generation to be backed down which then affected

01:00:27.369 --> 01:00:30.840
frequency. PRC was doing strange things. All these

01:00:30.849 --> 01:00:33.628
things were happening at once. Thus the, the need to

01:00:33.639 --> 01:00:36.918
act decisively and frankly in a short period of time

01:00:37.429 --> 01:00:42.059
And I'm I'm just trying, I think it would be useful

01:00:42.099 --> 01:00:45.349
as we move forward. And if these things happen, which

01:00:45.360 --> 01:00:49.289
they may happen in the, in the future, we get a better

01:00:49.300 --> 01:00:53.329
fix on where is the energy being trapped in, in those

01:00:53.340 --> 01:00:57.889
events? Where is it being depleted so that we identify

01:00:57.898 --> 01:00:59.958
regionally? And again, we, we talked about this during

01:00:59.969 --> 01:01:03.510
the PCM and the market design conversation. It's deliverability

01:01:03.519 --> 01:01:06.199
is a big part of this. I mean, I think you all

01:01:06.208 --> 01:01:10.590
are big believers in that and, and it's making your

01:01:10.599 --> 01:01:14.099
life more complicated. I think September 6th is, is

01:01:14.110 --> 01:01:17.579
like a heart condition. I mean, a blockage is now finally

01:01:17.590 --> 01:01:21.418
causing a major disruption in the system. And, and

01:01:21.489 --> 01:01:25.208
we've got to start to solve for that and, and batteries

01:01:25.219 --> 01:01:27.458
are a big part of that. And state of charge is a

01:01:27.469 --> 01:01:32.510
big part monitoring that I concede it. But I'd like

01:01:32.519 --> 01:01:34.860
to know where things are, where electrons are getting

01:01:34.869 --> 01:01:37.500
trapped and not able to assist the rest of the system

01:01:37.510 --> 01:01:41.219
Arrest these. And that's a good point, Commissioner

01:01:41.228 --> 01:01:44.239
McAdams because now we know, I mean, we know that there

01:01:44.250 --> 01:01:46.809
is an issue south of San Antonio and there will be

01:01:46.820 --> 01:01:50.780
one until the CPS energy transmission project is built

01:01:51.219 --> 01:01:54.530
And so how do we proactively tackle these situations

01:01:54.539 --> 01:01:57.469
in the future? Um When we know we're going to have

01:01:57.478 --> 01:02:02.119
low wind, low solar in the in the north zones and we

01:02:02.128 --> 01:02:06.010
may end up in a situation where as he as will just

01:02:06.019 --> 01:02:08.679
noted, you know, a comp of events where you can't get

01:02:08.688 --> 01:02:12.478
generation out of the south, we have low um renewables

01:02:12.489 --> 01:02:14.639
some forced outages, just a combination of things,

01:02:14.648 --> 01:02:18.250
how, what can we do to proactively deal with that situation

01:02:18.260 --> 01:02:21.199
So we don't end up in a tailspin um in the future

01:02:21.208 --> 01:02:22.869
because we know we're going to have those solar ram

01:02:22.878 --> 01:02:26.909
downs. We know we're gonna have hot nights. We, we

01:02:26.918 --> 01:02:29.610
all this information is just known now at this point

01:02:29.619 --> 01:02:33.719
So making sure we're proactively planning um for the

01:02:33.728 --> 01:02:36.610
same circumstances that could arise in the near future

01:02:36.619 --> 01:02:40.989
again. So I guess several thoughts on that. The, the

01:02:41.000 --> 01:02:45.340
um so we're just in the, in the interim period where

01:02:45.349 --> 01:02:48.478
we are working with the transmission owners to see

01:02:48.489 --> 01:02:50.780
if there are kind of small incremental things that

01:02:50.789 --> 01:02:55.349
we can do to help until the there is a planned transmission

01:02:55.360 --> 01:02:58.579
line that will help with that constraint that's already

01:02:58.590 --> 01:03:00.708
been gone through the regional planning process. And

01:03:00.719 --> 01:03:04.199
it, it's um um kind of in the, in the process of

01:03:04.208 --> 01:03:06.289
being constructed, but several, several years out.

01:03:06.300 --> 01:03:08.860
And so we'll, we'll be working on kind of incrementally

01:03:08.869 --> 01:03:12.760
what can we do. And um, so that, that's, that's the

01:03:12.769 --> 01:03:14.969
first thing. The second thing is the planning group

01:03:14.978 --> 01:03:18.148
has gone back and looked at, ok, what would they have

01:03:18.159 --> 01:03:23.228
had to see differently back in say 2017 or so in order

01:03:23.239 --> 01:03:26.769
to get to, so that a line would be in place by

01:03:26.780 --> 01:03:30.114
the, so if they'd seen this set of things, then we

01:03:30.125 --> 01:03:32.974
then they might have built the line earlier. And so

01:03:32.985 --> 01:03:35.023
that's a kind of a lessons learned thing. We go back

01:03:35.034 --> 01:03:38.284
look at these set of things. Ok? How, how can we going

01:03:38.293 --> 01:03:41.304
forward, start to identify those things more as you

01:03:41.313 --> 01:03:45.228
say, proactively? Um And in fact, they're, they're

01:03:45.239 --> 01:03:47.949
they're looking at that, is that ok? We're building

01:03:47.958 --> 01:03:51.260
one line out of South Texas to, to it into the San

01:03:51.269 --> 01:03:54.030
Antonio area. Do we need another line? And they're

01:03:54.039 --> 01:03:57.070
starting already to look at that as part of the um

01:03:57.079 --> 01:04:01.628
uh the, the normal annual planning cycle. And so, so

01:04:01.639 --> 01:04:05.070
we are trying to, to, to use this as a lesson learned

01:04:05.079 --> 01:04:07.849
and, and get ahead of, of it going forward as well

01:04:07.860 --> 01:04:10.059
as solving the kind of immediate problem.

01:04:12.110 --> 01:04:14.918
What would be some incremental transmission improvements

01:04:14.929 --> 01:04:19.829
like just examples um if, if there is a, like a, a

01:04:19.840 --> 01:04:24.320
switch or a wave trap or some kind of device on a

01:04:24.329 --> 01:04:30.409
line that is the limiting element um that you can replace

01:04:30.418 --> 01:04:37.110
that fairly quickly, fairly low cost. Um And then that

01:04:37.369 --> 01:04:41.309
incrementally will raise the, the, the transfer capability

01:04:41.320 --> 01:04:43.070
on that line. Um

01:04:45.708 --> 01:04:50.280
We're also looking at at uh potential switching solutions

01:04:50.289 --> 01:04:52.929
that we were, we actually implemented on the, the,

01:04:52.938 --> 01:04:56.728
the day, the next day on the seventh. And, uh, can

01:04:56.739 --> 01:05:00.409
we, can we do that, uh, in other, you know, proactively

01:05:00.679 --> 01:05:04.918
uh, as a, what's called a PUC A PP plan? Uh

01:05:06.478 --> 01:05:08.619
I hate it when I forget what the acronyms are. We've

01:05:08.628 --> 01:05:11.458
got too many acronyms if, if, if I forget what they

01:05:11.469 --> 01:05:12.610
what they stand for.

01:05:14.519 --> 01:05:17.360
Um, but, but, you know, that's one of the things we're

01:05:17.369 --> 01:05:20.110
we're looking at is, is kind of small. It's not gonna

01:05:20.119 --> 01:05:22.958
it's not gonna provide, you know, 1000 megawatts more

01:05:22.969 --> 01:05:26.019
transfer capability, but it may hooch it up a little

01:05:26.949 --> 01:05:32.478
Ok. Thank you. And, and in that space, I know facility

01:05:32.489 --> 01:05:35.929
rating methodologies are, that's solely within the

01:05:36.360 --> 01:05:40.059
purview of the utility and CPS. Is that right? But

01:05:40.070 --> 01:05:43.889
do you get to work with them to, um,

01:05:45.679 --> 01:05:48.938
I mean, do you all have any authority or any

01:05:51.300 --> 01:05:55.139
right to see if facility rating methodologies are correct

01:05:55.148 --> 01:05:59.239
or accurately, not followed but accurate in terms of

01:05:59.250 --> 01:06:02.128
their ratings? I think they, the transmission companies

01:06:02.139 --> 01:06:05.378
provide those to us, we don't really have authority

01:06:05.389 --> 01:06:07.860
over them, although we are working with them. I think

01:06:07.869 --> 01:06:11.708
all the ones in this area recognize that they need

01:06:11.719 --> 01:06:14.829
to look at it. We've reviewed, like I said, the kind

01:06:14.840 --> 01:06:18.739
of minor upgrades that can be done looked and this

01:06:18.750 --> 01:06:22.398
line was already um dynamically rated. So during the

01:06:22.409 --> 01:06:24.559
winter, it's going to have a higher rating because

01:06:24.570 --> 01:06:29.510
of it's cooler. Um And so they are definitely working

01:06:29.519 --> 01:06:33.898
on those things. Ok, thanks. So it sounds like, you

01:06:33.909 --> 01:06:37.119
know, uh expectation of an after action report or root

01:06:37.128 --> 01:06:41.260
cause analysis is not only to identify what caused

01:06:41.269 --> 01:06:44.139
the issue, but also to address those things you can

01:06:44.148 --> 01:06:47.208
do in the near term, whether it's operational or it's

01:06:47.219 --> 01:06:50.510
capital improvement as well as, you know, kind of look

01:06:50.519 --> 01:06:54.219
for what things need to be done for the longer term

01:06:54.418 --> 01:06:57.199
solution, always with an eye on preventing it from

01:06:57.208 --> 01:07:00.570
occurring period. And so I think a lot of the things

01:07:00.579 --> 01:07:03.478
that you discussed here really hone in on that and

01:07:03.489 --> 01:07:06.760
um really thank you for your efforts on this and um

01:07:06.769 --> 01:07:10.250
we'll continue to be working with you and, and watching

01:07:10.260 --> 01:07:10.519
this.

01:07:13.320 --> 01:07:15.010
Thank you, Dan. Thanks Dan.

01:07:16.898 --> 01:07:22.010
Next up is item number 23 project number 54445. This

01:07:22.019 --> 01:07:25.019
is the commission's project for rules adopted by ERCOT

01:07:25.199 --> 01:07:27.280
Sheila. Do we have anyone from the public signed up

01:07:27.289 --> 01:07:31.619
to speak on item number 23? No, ma'am. Let's let's

01:07:31.628 --> 01:07:35.398
discuss uh n Pr R 1186 1st and then we'll discuss the

01:07:35.409 --> 01:07:40.070
seven administrative revision request. Uh On 1186 ERCOT

01:07:40.079 --> 01:07:44.099
filed a letter requesting we defer discussion and consideration

01:07:44.110 --> 01:07:48.938
of N Pr R 1186 to our January 18th open meeting to

01:07:48.949 --> 01:07:51.489
ensure that ERCOT can provide the best information

01:07:51.500 --> 01:07:54.239
possible and to allow a reasonable opportunity for

01:07:54.250 --> 01:07:57.789
review. ERCOT commits to file its presentation with

01:07:57.800 --> 01:08:01.418
the commission no later than January 4th. ERCOT has

01:08:01.429 --> 01:08:04.398
confirmed that delaying consideration of this N Pr

01:08:04.409 --> 01:08:08.159
R would not delay any of ERCOT s other market initiatives

01:08:08.179 --> 01:08:11.728
including real time Co optimization Commission. Staff

01:08:11.739 --> 01:08:14.619
filed a memo regarding ERCOT S proposal and finds it

01:08:14.628 --> 01:08:18.088
reasonable. Staff is recommending interested parties

01:08:18.100 --> 01:08:21.479
submit written comments in response to ERCOT S materials

01:08:21.489 --> 01:08:25.810
be permitted until January 11th with a limit of five

01:08:25.819 --> 01:08:30.539
pages. I'm good with ERCOT S timeline and staff's recommendations

01:08:30.548 --> 01:08:34.699
Do we have any thoughts? Well, I'm good with it. Uh

01:08:36.750 --> 01:08:37.750
But I love to hear your thoughts.

01:08:39.949 --> 01:08:44.539
Yeah, I'm I'm obviously I have taken issue with this

01:08:44.770 --> 01:08:50.798
NPRR. I am fine with this. I am concerned as I voiced

01:08:50.810 --> 01:08:54.020
to Woody at ERCOT about the staff time that it's taking

01:08:54.029 --> 01:08:58.779
to, to analyze this little interim solution that

01:09:00.519 --> 01:09:02.957
will be resolved and the number of hours that it's

01:09:02.969 --> 01:09:05.908
taking of the senior staff people that could be working

01:09:05.917 --> 01:09:10.429
on RT CB. I think there is a concern there within me

01:09:10.438 --> 01:09:15.269
but I'm happy to delay this discussion for another

01:09:15.278 --> 01:09:17.269
until the January open meeting.

01:09:18.939 --> 01:09:23.409
Yeah, I I um emphasize with your points. Um Commissioner

01:09:23.829 --> 01:09:25.739
Glotfelty on we, we've spent a lot of time on this

01:09:25.750 --> 01:09:30.020
this uh M pr R I mean months and I wanna make

01:09:30.029 --> 01:09:33.180
sure that we get all the information that um ERCOT

01:09:33.189 --> 01:09:37.439
can provide before we uh take action on it. I know

01:09:37.449 --> 01:09:39.918
that, you know, there's a suite of, of questions and

01:09:39.930 --> 01:09:43.587
concerns that we raised at the last open meeting that

01:09:43.658 --> 01:09:46.257
ERCOT wants an opportunity to provide more detailed

01:09:46.269 --> 01:09:48.297
information. I really do hope that we get some good

01:09:48.309 --> 01:09:51.898
information from ERCOT this, this next round um to

01:09:52.188 --> 01:09:54.719
to help us better understand the issue as they're seeing

01:09:54.729 --> 01:09:58.938
it. Um from their perspective, I know the battery companies

01:09:58.948 --> 01:10:02.278
want certainty sooner rather than later on this issue

01:10:02.288 --> 01:10:04.667
And I'm sympathetic to that as well. I think just having

01:10:04.679 --> 01:10:07.627
a more robust record with ERCOT S information, stakeholder

01:10:07.639 --> 01:10:12.418
feedback will benefit us in the long run. Um But iii

01:10:12.489 --> 01:10:16.079
I think that we need to um find a way to move

01:10:16.088 --> 01:10:19.100
past this issue sooner rather than later because it

01:10:19.109 --> 01:10:21.109
is, it has taken up a lot of our time and I

01:10:21.119 --> 01:10:23.489
know it's been taking up a lot of Burt's time as well

01:10:23.500 --> 01:10:25.810
and, and we have a lot of very important market reform

01:10:25.970 --> 01:10:30.329
measures that need to be um put in place. And um I

01:10:30.338 --> 01:10:33.430
think that's the focus that we need to be um really

01:10:33.439 --> 01:10:36.250
focused on. So I look forward to Eco's information

01:10:36.259 --> 01:10:39.539
and additional stakeholder feedback and we'll tackle

01:10:39.548 --> 01:10:42.430
it at the January 18th open meeting. Ok. So it sounds

01:10:42.439 --> 01:10:44.449
like we're all in agreement and we'll bring up N Pr

01:10:44.458 --> 01:10:49.220
R 1186 on January the 18th. Next, we'll discuss the

01:10:49.229 --> 01:10:52.659
seven administrative revision request. C staff filed

01:10:52.668 --> 01:10:55.899
a memo and a proposed order recommending approval of

01:10:55.909 --> 01:10:59.250
seven administrative revision requests. Any thoughts

01:10:59.520 --> 01:11:03.520
I'm in agreement and move their adoption. Ok. We have

01:11:03.560 --> 01:11:08.359
a motion to approve the proposed order for adoption

01:11:09.000 --> 01:11:13.000
We have a second all in favor. Say I motion passes

01:11:13.640 --> 01:11:18.109
I don't have anything on items 24 or 25. Next up is

01:11:18.119 --> 01:11:22.509
item number 26. Project number 55250, this is the commission's

01:11:22.520 --> 01:11:25.250
rulemaking regarding its transmission and distribution

01:11:25.259 --> 01:11:28.439
system resiliency plans. Sheila, do we have anyone

01:11:28.449 --> 01:11:31.270
from the public signed up to speak on item number 26

01:11:31.489 --> 01:11:34.899
No, ma'am. PUC staff filed a memo and proposal for

01:11:34.909 --> 01:11:37.810
adoption due to staff's recommendation having been

01:11:37.819 --> 01:11:41.220
filed yesterday. I would like to delay consideration

01:11:41.229 --> 01:11:44.259
of this item and table it until the next open meeting

01:11:44.418 --> 01:11:47.918
to allow more time for me to review and to allow more

01:11:47.930 --> 01:11:49.640
time for stakeholders to review.

01:11:51.239 --> 01:11:53.039
I'm good with that too. I'm in agreement.

01:11:54.628 --> 01:11:57.048
I'm supportive, Sheila Connie. Will you please add

01:11:57.060 --> 01:12:01.819
this item to our January 18th agenda? Next up is item

01:12:01.829 --> 01:12:05.918
number 27. Project number 55320, this is the commission's

01:12:05.930 --> 01:12:09.789
project for RFP for consulting services. Relating to

01:12:09.798 --> 01:12:13.378
electric emergency operations plan and whether emergency

01:12:13.390 --> 01:12:17.720
preparedness plans, preparedness reports. Sheila, do

01:12:17.729 --> 01:12:20.208
we have anyone from the public signed up to speak on

01:12:20.220 --> 01:12:24.720
item number 27 ma'am. Commission staff filed a memo

01:12:24.729 --> 01:12:28.128
in a proposed order. This is a routine delegation of

01:12:28.140 --> 01:12:31.079
authority to the executive director to enter into a

01:12:31.088 --> 01:12:35.060
contract. I'm good with the proposed order. Um

01:12:36.750 --> 01:12:39.569
For I would entertain a motion to approve the proposed

01:12:39.579 --> 01:12:43.350
order. So I have a motion in a second, all in favor

01:12:43.359 --> 01:12:46.899
Say a, a motion passes. Thanks for coming in.

01:12:51.458 --> 01:12:55.479
Next up is item number 28 project number 55421. This

01:12:55.489 --> 01:12:57.628
is the commission's project for the Texas Advanced

01:12:57.640 --> 01:13:00.609
nuclear reactor working group, Sheila. Do we have anyone

01:13:00.619 --> 01:13:03.259
from the public signed up to speak on item

01:13:07.989 --> 01:13:11.729
number 28 commissioner. Um We had a great meeting in

01:13:11.739 --> 01:13:16.208
here a few weeks ago, a week ago. Um The whole room

01:13:16.220 --> 01:13:19.079
was totally rearranged. So thank you for the all of

01:13:19.088 --> 01:13:23.640
the team uh within the PUC that ar arranged and rearranged

01:13:23.869 --> 01:13:27.850
Uh that's cords, that's uh cameras, that's microphones

01:13:27.859 --> 01:13:29.939
everything. It was, it took quite an effort, but it

01:13:29.949 --> 01:13:33.720
was a, it was a very well received meeting. We had

01:13:33.729 --> 01:13:38.720
well over 100 people online and we had, you know, maybe

01:13:38.729 --> 01:13:42.789
25 or 30 within the room. Our guest was the nuclear

01:13:42.798 --> 01:13:46.600
regulatory commissioner David Wright, um madam chairman

01:13:46.609 --> 01:13:49.319
I'm appreciative that you spent time with us as well

01:13:50.060 --> 01:13:51.970
And I think the most important thing coming out of

01:13:51.979 --> 01:13:56.029
that meeting was we have decreased the number of our

01:13:56.039 --> 01:14:00.239
working groups from 7 to 4. We have put leadership

01:14:00.250 --> 01:14:03.229
together on all of those and they are often running

01:14:03.239 --> 01:14:10.109
So the goal here is to help manage that, but to push

01:14:10.119 --> 01:14:14.079
them to think creatively and see what the state needs

01:14:14.088 --> 01:14:16.520
to do. So we're excited that, that they're off and

01:14:16.529 --> 01:14:21.529
running now. Ok. Well, great, great update and uh really

01:14:21.539 --> 01:14:23.289
enjoyed meeting Commissioner Ryan. I think that was

01:14:23.298 --> 01:14:27.449
a real tribute to the work at work group here in Texas

01:14:27.458 --> 01:14:29.770
that, you know, he felt like that that was important

01:14:29.779 --> 01:14:32.199
to come and become a part of this. And uh of course

01:14:32.208 --> 01:14:35.128
lots of work ahead and appreciate as always your leadership

01:14:35.140 --> 01:14:38.890
Absolutely. Uh Next up is item number 29 project number

01:14:38.899 --> 01:14:42.680
55718. This is the commission's project for the reliability

01:14:42.689 --> 01:14:45.470
plan for the Permian Basin, Sheila. Do we have anyone

01:14:45.479 --> 01:14:48.600
from the public signed it to speak on item number 29

01:14:48.609 --> 01:14:51.970
Yeah, ma'am Lori. I appreciate you traveling to Midland

01:14:52.338 --> 01:14:55.009
and hosting the permanent Basin Electric Reliability

01:14:55.020 --> 01:14:58.000
plan workshop. I think it's always great to meet the

01:14:58.009 --> 01:15:00.418
boots on the ground people and get their input. Uh

01:15:00.430 --> 01:15:03.029
Would you like to provide an update from the workshop

01:15:03.039 --> 01:15:06.088
and then lay out your memo and proposed order? Yes

01:15:06.100 --> 01:15:08.029
Thank you madam chair. It was, it was a pleasure to

01:15:08.039 --> 01:15:11.020
go to Midland Odessa um it's kind of like going back

01:15:11.029 --> 01:15:14.418
home and told everybody that I had attended Texas Tech

01:15:14.430 --> 01:15:16.119
and I got more guns up than I would ever get in

01:15:16.128 --> 01:15:18.489
Austin. So that was, that was pretty cool. I even got

01:15:18.500 --> 01:15:20.259
a chance to wear black and red. So it was, it was

01:15:20.270 --> 01:15:23.819
kind of nice. Um So as chair Jackson mentioned, um

01:15:23.829 --> 01:15:25.918
the commission held a workshop on Tuesday in Midland

01:15:25.930 --> 01:15:27.869
to kick off the discussion of the development of a

01:15:27.878 --> 01:15:31.229
reliability plan for the Permian Basin region. Pursuant

01:15:31.239 --> 01:15:36.079
to house Bill 5066. Um as the commissioner leading

01:15:36.088 --> 01:15:39.079
the effort uh to have ERCOT develop a reliability plan

01:15:39.088 --> 01:15:41.298
for the Permian Basin. I attended the workshop and

01:15:41.310 --> 01:15:44.000
provided some opening remarks. The workshop was very

01:15:44.009 --> 01:15:47.220
well attended, uh bringing together representatives

01:15:47.229 --> 01:15:49.378
from the oil and gas industry transmission service

01:15:49.390 --> 01:15:53.699
providers in and outside of um the region. Uh PUC staff

01:15:53.770 --> 01:15:57.418
ERCOT, staff and the region's legislative delegation

01:15:57.430 --> 01:15:59.409
and local officials. I want to give a special thank

01:15:59.418 --> 01:16:03.509
you to Senator Sparks. Uh State representatives Cradock

01:16:03.520 --> 01:16:06.279
and Landgraf and Ear County Judge Fawcett for attending

01:16:06.289 --> 01:16:09.140
the workshop. The workshop, panelists from the oil

01:16:09.149 --> 01:16:11.640
and gas industry transmission companies or kind of

01:16:11.649 --> 01:16:14.100
PUC provided valuable feedback including the oil and

01:16:14.109 --> 01:16:17.259
gas industry's need for additional transmission and

01:16:17.270 --> 01:16:19.759
dispatchable generation resources to electrify their

01:16:19.770 --> 01:16:23.569
operations. They were very focused on the industry

01:16:23.579 --> 01:16:25.319
as a whole. The oil and gas industry as a whole is

01:16:25.329 --> 01:16:30.159
very focused and, and uh strongly desires a reliable

01:16:30.168 --> 01:16:33.060
affordable and clean supply of power. The transmission

01:16:33.069 --> 01:16:35.850
service providers um provided information on their

01:16:35.859 --> 01:16:39.199
construction process. And Ian PUC C provided information

01:16:39.208 --> 01:16:43.399
on the transmission planning and CN process. This kickoff

01:16:43.409 --> 01:16:46.520
workshop um demonstrates our strong commitment at the

01:16:46.529 --> 01:16:49.359
commission to work with ERCOT, the applicable T SPS

01:16:49.369 --> 01:16:51.489
and the oil and gas industry to ensure the delivery

01:16:51.500 --> 01:16:54.418
of a timely and effective reliability plan for the

01:16:54.430 --> 01:16:57.489
Permian basin region. An area that is important for

01:16:57.500 --> 01:17:00.729
our state. Our state's economy in the world. Texas

01:17:00.739 --> 01:17:03.350
is the number one energy producing state in the United

01:17:03.359 --> 01:17:06.819
States. Texas Energy Power is the world and the Permian

01:17:06.829 --> 01:17:09.720
Basin is a critically important part of this success

01:17:10.829 --> 01:17:13.689
And so, um I wanna thank cause before I lay out uh

01:17:13.699 --> 01:17:16.838
this memo, I, I wanna thank um all of the stakeholders

01:17:16.850 --> 01:17:19.649
that were involved in providing me feedback on this

01:17:19.659 --> 01:17:24.418
um initiative, um ERCOT um Woody and, and Christie

01:17:24.430 --> 01:17:29.819
and P pu um And um the stakeholders Oncor, on behalf

01:17:29.829 --> 01:17:33.850
of the, the T SPS and the oil and gas industry um

01:17:33.859 --> 01:17:38.338
associations, Tex Soga, um Shana, Todd Staples, uh

01:17:38.350 --> 01:17:42.489
Permian Basin Petroleum Association, Mike Lozano and

01:17:42.500 --> 01:17:45.739
uh the Texas Energy um alliance of energy producers

01:17:45.750 --> 01:17:48.128
Jason Magle, who was involved throughout most of the

01:17:48.140 --> 01:17:50.548
process. Um He's no longer with the Association, but

01:17:50.560 --> 01:17:55.569
I wanted to thank him anyway. Um And so, you know,

01:17:55.579 --> 01:18:00.109
my memo um as stated House Bill 5066 requires the commission

01:18:00.119 --> 01:18:04.789
to direct ERCOT by January 30th 2024 to develop a reliability

01:18:04.798 --> 01:18:07.850
plan for the Permian Basin region. In order to comply

01:18:07.859 --> 01:18:11.199
with the statutory obligation, I have filed a memo

01:18:11.208 --> 01:18:13.369
that includes a proposed order that directs ERCOT to

01:18:13.378 --> 01:18:15.949
develop the reliability plan for the Permian Basin

01:18:15.958 --> 01:18:18.958
region. The proposed order specifically attachment

01:18:18.970 --> 01:18:22.390
a to the proposed order sets forth the proposed procedural

01:18:22.399 --> 01:18:25.869
process and timeline to ensure that ERCOT timely and

01:18:25.878 --> 01:18:29.810
effectively delivers uh develops and delivers a reliable

01:18:29.819 --> 01:18:33.270
plan to for the premium basin for the commission's

01:18:33.279 --> 01:18:36.628
approval. The proposed timeline provides that ERCOT

01:18:36.640 --> 01:18:39.770
will file a final reliability plan at the commission

01:18:39.779 --> 01:18:43.409
in July of 2024 provides an opportunity for stakeholder

01:18:43.418 --> 01:18:46.649
feedback on the final reliability plan and commission

01:18:46.659 --> 01:18:49.869
approval of a reliability plan in September of 2024

01:18:50.569 --> 01:18:53.600
I would emphasize that this timeline is, is heavily

01:18:53.609 --> 01:18:57.770
contingent upon the T SPS providing rot with the necessary

01:18:57.779 --> 01:19:01.369
customer load data. Um So ERCOT can start developing

01:19:01.378 --> 01:19:06.350
the plan this next year. And so, um with that said

01:19:06.359 --> 01:19:09.958
um I I have the proposed order with attachment a um

01:19:09.970 --> 01:19:12.770
available to take action on, but I do want to say something

01:19:13.069 --> 01:19:16.739
Uh I know that I've had some T SPS come through and

01:19:16.750 --> 01:19:19.930
um note the importance of implementing the rest of

01:19:19.939 --> 01:19:24.520
house bill 5066. Um And, and you know, our state's

01:19:24.529 --> 01:19:27.029
growing, uh our electricity needs are growing in uh

01:19:27.039 --> 01:19:30.588
in areas outside of the Permian Basin. And um you know

01:19:30.600 --> 01:19:33.168
I visit had a chance to get feedback from staff and

01:19:33.180 --> 01:19:35.390
and we're gonna try to prioritize that implementation

01:19:35.399 --> 01:19:39.689
of, of the um rest of house bill 5066 to ensure that

01:19:39.699 --> 01:19:43.029
other areas of the state are um getting the infrastructure

01:19:43.039 --> 01:19:45.409
they need to maintain reliability and serve their growing

01:19:45.418 --> 01:19:48.208
electricity needs sometime this next year. Um And we'll

01:19:48.220 --> 01:19:51.199
try to get to that as soon as we can. And um

01:19:51.229 --> 01:19:54.319
but I wanted it to say that uh before I take a

01:19:54.329 --> 01:19:57.649
motion on, on the proposed order and, and attachment

01:20:00.079 --> 01:20:01.529
Very good. Do you have any thoughts

01:20:03.350 --> 01:20:07.329
madam chair? I, I agree. I think statute directs us

01:20:07.338 --> 01:20:11.909
to take action on this and this is a special case because

01:20:11.918 --> 01:20:15.140
of that statutory direction. And so I, I support Commissioner

01:20:15.369 --> 01:20:19.298
Cobos memo and plan as outlined and look forward from

01:20:19.310 --> 01:20:22.659
the outside, looking in in the future, seeing how this

01:20:22.668 --> 01:20:26.009
progresses and assists and ensuring that deliverability

01:20:26.020 --> 01:20:26.770
across the state.

01:20:28.500 --> 01:20:31.329
I agree as well. And if you would allow me, I would

01:20:31.338 --> 01:20:34.279
move to approve Commissioner Cobos proposed order.

01:20:36.970 --> 01:20:40.668
We have a motion in a second all in favor. Say I

01:20:40.680 --> 01:20:42.270
I the motion passes,

01:20:46.069 --> 01:20:48.729
we already took up item number 30. I don't have anything

01:20:48.739 --> 01:20:53.359
on item number 31. Next up. We will take items 32 and

01:20:53.369 --> 01:20:59.189
33 together. Item 32 is the project number 4121. The

01:20:59.199 --> 01:21:01.449
commission's project for information related to the

01:21:01.458 --> 01:21:05.689
organization of MISO States. Item number 3033 project

01:21:05.699 --> 01:21:09.449
Number 41210, the commission's project for information

01:21:09.458 --> 01:21:12.378
related to the Southwest Power Pool Regional State

01:21:12.390 --> 01:21:14.708
Committee, Sheila, do we have anyone from the public

01:21:14.720 --> 01:21:20.779
sign to speak on item 32 or 33 with Commissioner McAdams

01:21:20.789 --> 01:21:23.750
departure. Uh, Commissioner Cobos will serve as the

01:21:23.759 --> 01:21:26.859
Texas delegate to the Southwest Power Pool regional

01:21:26.869 --> 01:21:29.720
State Committee. And Commissioner Glotfelty will serve

01:21:29.729 --> 01:21:32.750
as the Texas delegate delegate to the org organization

01:21:32.759 --> 01:21:38.189
of Miso states effective January 1 2024. Uh Lori and

01:21:38.199 --> 01:21:41.039
Jimmy, I know you both will represent Texas. Well,

01:21:41.069 --> 01:21:43.918
and thank you so much for stepping up and taking on

01:21:43.930 --> 01:21:47.029
these additional responsibilities. Thank you madam

01:21:47.039 --> 01:21:51.000
chair. Got big shoes to fill in sp I think. Well, as

01:21:51.009 --> 01:21:54.939
Washington said to Adams, I am surely out and you are

01:21:54.949 --> 01:21:55.729
surely in.

01:21:58.829 --> 01:22:02.220
Thank you, Commissioner Becca Adams. We will miss those

01:22:02.229 --> 01:22:03.628
little anecdotes.

01:22:06.079 --> 01:22:11.458
Do you have an SP P update? Yes, ma'am of late. The

01:22:11.470 --> 01:22:14.970
Federal Energy Regulatory Commission rejected Southwest

01:22:14.979 --> 01:22:18.909
Power Pool's imposition of a winter capacity obligation

01:22:19.829 --> 01:22:26.430
They did. So because the outage policy planned outages

01:22:26.439 --> 01:22:30.819
during those during those seasonal months of capacity

01:22:30.829 --> 01:22:34.750
obligation were not harmonized with the summer policy

01:22:35.399 --> 01:22:39.270
Put it in perspective in Southwest Power Pool during

01:22:39.279 --> 01:22:43.009
May 15th through September 15th, for which the summer

01:22:43.020 --> 01:22:45.708
capacity obligation is in place for all vertically

01:22:45.720 --> 01:22:50.009
integrated utilities serving the system outages are

01:22:50.020 --> 01:22:53.829
not accepted on the system. So therefore, you may not

01:22:53.838 --> 01:22:57.520
take outages what FERC took exception to is that we

01:22:57.529 --> 01:23:00.970
imposed a capacity obligation for winter months, but

01:23:00.979 --> 01:23:05.649
we were still allowing limited outages to be approved

01:23:05.659 --> 01:23:10.810
during that season and they objected to the incongruous

01:23:10.819 --> 01:23:15.759
policy contract. So happily enough, this is one of

01:23:15.770 --> 01:23:18.500
the issues that both the resource and energy adequacy

01:23:18.509 --> 01:23:22.329
leader, leadership team is working feverishly on right

01:23:22.338 --> 01:23:27.359
now to have a, a policy construct proposed by January

01:23:27.369 --> 01:23:30.079
of next year. And that's our top priority right now

01:23:30.088 --> 01:23:33.069
in real team, I'll, I'll lead that last meeting of

01:23:33.079 --> 01:23:36.479
the real team for this year before I sign off station

01:23:36.909 --> 01:23:40.609
and that will be Monday and then I'll, I'll hand over

01:23:40.619 --> 01:23:43.640
those duties to. It is my understanding, Commissioner

01:23:43.649 --> 01:23:45.520
Christy Fen from South Dakota.

01:23:48.199 --> 01:23:52.199
The, the outage policy problem is not insurmountable

01:23:52.208 --> 01:23:54.500
I think we can crack the code on that. I think Commissioner

01:23:54.810 --> 01:23:56.298
Cobos, you're going to be able to hit the ground running

01:23:56.310 --> 01:24:00.609
in SPP and a revision and basically a remediation strategy

01:24:00.619 --> 01:24:07.199
to cure Ferc's rejection can be filed within the back

01:24:07.208 --> 01:24:10.149
part of Q one to early part of Q two next year

01:24:10.338 --> 01:24:14.039
And, and we could have a policy framework in place

01:24:14.048 --> 01:24:18.060
for the winner of 2024 2025. So that concludes my update

01:24:18.069 --> 01:24:22.229
Ma I'm sure, thank you. Uh I don't have anything on

01:24:22.239 --> 01:24:27.329
items 34 through 41. There is nothing for closed session

01:24:28.220 --> 01:24:30.890
before joining this meeting. I would like to invite

01:24:30.899 --> 01:24:35.100
everyone to stick around for a surprise celebration

01:24:35.109 --> 01:24:39.100
To honor Will for his service at the PUC C. We have

01:24:39.109 --> 01:24:45.119
lemonade cake and cookies. So please join us for his

01:24:45.128 --> 01:24:50.048
final meeting as a commissioner of the PUC, I'll, I'll

01:24:50.060 --> 01:24:53.208
yield the chair to Commissioner McAdams to please.

01:24:54.750 --> 01:24:54.909
Oh,

01:24:58.270 --> 01:24:58.918
thank you. Got you.

01:25:01.750 --> 01:25:04.069
There being no further business to come before the

01:25:04.079 --> 01:25:06.838
commission. This meeting of the Public Utility Commission

01:25:06.850 --> 01:25:09.770
of Texas is hereby adjourned at 1105.